Gaming Outpost Discussions

1. 

   M. J. Young
   Moderator

   I have a post from Maxx, and then I'll have to decide whether I am in the mood to deal with John 2 before turning my attention to Graeme. Well, one step at a time.

   Well, Maxx took some time, but we've got him together.

   John 2 is trying to design a martial arts skill, for which I've opened a new thread, Spinning Backhand Punch.

   I hate to make Graeme's post short, but it occurs to me that he doesn't have a driver for the car he wants to attempt to protect and detect while it is in motion, so he's going to need to come up with one.

   --M. J. Young

   Wed Jul 15 2009 12:39 am #
2. 

   JohnA1nut
   Member

   I'm not surprised at all by your reaction, only that it took so long.

   Wed Jul 15 2009 12:47 am #
3. 

   johnosevens
   Member

   To both Ahmetia and MJ, I apologize for my prolonged absence. I assure you both it was due to technical difficulties (my cable modem deciding not to play well with my router) and not anything worse.

   Wed Jul 15 2009 2:10 am #
4. 

   WilliamTWodium
   Member

   I'm sure no apology is necessary - or if it is, I've got a positively frightening backlog of apologies that I need to take care of.

   Wed Jul 15 2009 2:20 am #
5. 

   Brock
   Member

   I know the feeling of bad connections-I almost didn't get here today.

   Wed Jul 15 2009 3:10 am #
6. 

   M. J. Young
   Moderator

   Speaking of apologies, I just realized that I am too tired to work through all of tonight's threads and be able to make sense of them, so I'm going to beg off for tonight. I've run games sometimes when I am falling asleep at the keys or the table, and it's not a pretty sight, I assure you.

   Harry, you need not apologize to me for short absences. It usually takes a month for me to realize that someone hasn't been posting much lately, and it's only then that I wonder whether they quit because they weren't enjoying it, or got too busy with other things and couldn't make time for it, or had technical problems which blocked them from the site. I would hope that anyone who was dropping out of the game would drop me a note and explain, and thus anyone who doesn't send me such a note is assumed to have been prevented from posting by circumstances beyond his control, whether social or technical.

   --M. J. Young

   Thu Jul 16 2009 1:17 am #
7. 

   JohnA1nut
   Member

   Speaking as someone who just woke up from a nap, I certainly know what you mean. Get some sleep. We would rather have you rested and running games coherently than to not be.

   Thu Jul 16 2009 1:37 am #
8. 

   Oak
   Member

   I hate to say that I am pleased at a low turnout today, but the fact is that I'm working on little enough sleep that I can't figure out how little it is.

   Glad to be of service... ;)

   Sorry I've been out for awhile. Last month I took over as caretaker GM for Eric with the Worldwalker game on RPoL while he takes a long overdue sabbatical, and my hands are pretty full. So it may be awhile before I can post regularly here.

   But I haven't forgotten y'all. And I certainly haven't forgotten Multiverser! :D

   I wasn't certain whether or not you saw this when I posted it in June, MJ, so I thought I'd double-check to make sure... :)

   Thu Jul 16 2009 3:22 pm #
9. 

   M. J. Young
   Moderator

   Good to see you, Oak. Actually, now that you repeat it I do remember seeing it, but I had wondered whether you were all right.

   Starting fresh on a new day, we'll work our way through posts from Brock, Maxx, Harry, Scott, John 2, and Graeme, six player.

   I'm dropping a few words from Iggy in to Brock's thread, just for something to post, and because what Scott said made me think that might be useful.

   Working through questions by Maxx, I realize that the question of whether Lelach's grandmother is still alive is not part of the material created for this world, so a GE roll should determine it. A 16 probably means she is alive but not terribly well.

   The prayer requires more attention. It is a M7@7 Communicate Off-world, particularly since it expects an answer, although it will accept a dream or what might be a hunch, something less than a clear answer. I'll give +10 for that, which he's going to need since he's got thought only, being unable to think or to do much in the way of movement, which means apart from all the bonuses he doesn't get he takes a -25 penalty. However, it is clearly a prayer, so we need to know a lot more about his religion.

   He is still too small for his mother to feel him, and his 0@2 strength is not going to enable him to do much yet.

   Harry has been awaiting word on how his plan goes, but it depends entirely on the actions of non-player characters, so instead of inventing batches of attributes and skills and rolling lots of checks, I resolve it with a GE roll: 19. That's a not thwarting but generally unfavorable result.

   Scott rolled 98 on his new skill, which could be rather dangerous, but I'm not certain. He's got a hefty +49 SM built in, and his bias is 15@1 against a 13@1 skill, plus it is one of his few holy magic skills so he gets +11 for half his 2@2 religion. That, though, has me wondering what the affiliation of this world is. With his 2@6 BRA and without the affiliation adjustment we're looking at 106%, but if it's an anarch world (which it might be) that faces a -10 penalty for 96%--he would not have botched, but he would not have succeeded either. Scott's pretty straight on these things; I'll ask him.

   John 2 is still hammering out the details of his latest maneuver.

   Trying to recast the protections, Graeme rolls 91--oh, wait, he has to do this six times, doesn't he? Or is he only working in one direction at the moment? I any case, searching for his chance of success with the protection skill I find that I said he gained a mark for hiding the car, but that's not showing on his sheet, so let's make it 1@2; it has a +1 sit-mod, the bias around here is 7@ so he gets +14 for that, and he has a 2@2 BRA, so his chance of success is 49%, failure 51%, botch 6%, and a 91 fails but does not botch. He then casts his detect five times, for which his chance of success is 2@2 BRA+2x7@ bias+1@1 which I'm raising to 1@2 because he used it against a protection skill, +15 Sit-mod=63% chance of success, unopposed because the protect skill did not work. I roll 93, 29, 84, 03, 93, not particularly good rolls but two of them worked.

   I'm fading, but I think I'm nearly finished anyway.

   --M. J. Young

   Fri Jul 17 2009 1:16 am #
10. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    My fatigue and tardiness are actually not very closely related, the latter due to e-mail questions about time travel and the former due to a house guest family member who is more demanding than she ought to be. But let me see if I can manage in the time remaining to get through posts from Brock, Maxx, Harry, Scott, and John 2.

    Brock is coming to the end of a day.

    I'm going to give Maxx a high amateur 1@9 Focus Senses P3@0 sensitivity variant enables sorting specific auditory or other sensory information from background. I'm also going to roll it, and 82 is failure.

    He has claimed a 1@5 SAL in an undisclosed alliance faith, so we add +18 (half the religion SAL and the bonus for an alliance world) to his chance of success on that prayer. Complicating it, though, he says he has done this before--prayed for God to guide him. I'll give his other self such a skill, and mark that it requires speaking aloud; that will give him a 7@7 bias and a 1@5 example to create this new skill. Our -25 is thus offset by +15 example and +10 for permitting vague results, and that leaves the +18, the +15 world bias, and +19 for his BRA, 52% chance of success here, and he rolls 96--not a botch, barely.

    I'm calling his date day 53, as he's been rather busy over a short time.

    The question is whether Harry can get a read minds on a stranger with a roll of 35, and the answer is bias 0+BRA 1@9+SAL 1@1=30, so no. He rolls a 16 GE on the interrogation.

    I am the more inclined to make Scott's world anarch, but also inclined to make his Discordian faith neutral from henceforth (I don't think it matters, as I don't believe he has ever gotten a bonus for affiliation that mattered). But we'll await his answer.

    John 2 cites an example from a movie. Fiction examples are automatically 1@1 barring something to suggest otherwise, and given that the people beating on each other in martial arts movies do not want to hurt each other, we can be pretty sure that it's a bad example.

    The skill he is trying to learn is Spinning Backhand Punch B7@3 intensified damage damaging attacker steps back with one foot, spins [counterclockwise?] and strikes the opponent in front of him with his [left?] hand for base damaging damage, -10SM; the example offsets the penalty for learning purposes, making it +1, and his 7@5 bias minus the target skill 7@3 bias gives him another +2, +1@9 Bod BRA and what the heck is the bod bias in this world? Right, 15@10 to allow for just about any unimaginable alien body skills. So we add +15, plus his 1@10 MSV minus her defensive values, previously calculated at -30, 42% chance of pulling this off. He rolls 82.

    It strikes me that we need to roll initiative (something that was deferred pending outcome of the decisions about the maneuver), so the question is whether John misses her first or only after she gets two swings at him, and his chance of success is 42, he rolls 78, she 42, so she's going to roll twice, 58, 32, and after his failure 90, 14. Her chance to hit him is 66%, so that's several hits. She resists the temptation to comment, because she knows that this gives away her position in the dark.

    --M. J. Young

    Sat Jul 18 2009 1:41 am #
11. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Tardiness? You're here early. Tardy would be 3 or 4 am, which you have done several times.

    One thing which cannot be said is that MJ is not dedicated to this game.

    Sat Jul 18 2009 2:19 am #
12. 

    WilliamTWodium
    Member

    I don't think I've ever gotten an affiliation bonus at all - I've never done holy magic in a universe where the skill was possible.

    Oh, wait - making the holy symbol. But yeah, I was over 200% on that one, so it didn't matter. I don't think we even picked an affiliation then.

    Sat Jul 18 2009 2:36 am #
13. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    Brock, Maxx, Harry, Scott, and John 2 are in play.

    Scott hits the same point which occurred to me: is there a moon? The GE roll is 20, which is just bad enough, and since Brock wants to walk by the light of the moon he will see the last crescent set in the dusk of the sun.

    Maxx is falling into a routine, which lets the time accelerate. We'll roll for his meditation and focus senses skill uses 83, 51, and now shift to a GE roll to cover some time: 18, he's not getting too much information but we can move forward in his development. We last marked Day 53, so we'll move forward to the end of the twelfth week, Day 84, because there are landmark changes over this time. With a roll of 30 he fails a difficult intuition check, so I can't just tell him some of these; but I can give him the opportunity to explore.

    Harry is trying to reach a decision about how to handle the situation. I took the liberty of rolling another read minds check, 49, to save time.

    We have now agreed that Scott's religion is neutral, and that means that new skill/spell works. That skill is listed as 1@3 Induce Pleasure/Comfort M+13@1 Caster places his holy symbol atop the target's head and, in each hand, holds a wingnut while forming the numeral V sign; he then lightly pokes the target all over with both hands while pronouncing specific passages* selected from the Principia Discordia. The caster then snaps the fingers of both hands in the target's ears, saying, "There; feel better?" Target remains comfortable and feels pleasurable sensations for RS/20 days, which over time may result in +1 bonuses to all skills and attributes (including, additionally, averaged attributes) at the referee's discretion; sound necessary, TF 2:00, +49 SM.

    John 2 rolls 16 on a simple stamina check, a strong success against his 1@8 stamina. The initiative rolls are 81, 48, Lauren goes twice before John tries his maneuver again, 56, 07, and then he rolls 18, a success. The agreed skill description is 1@1 Spinning Backhand Punch B7@3 intensified damage damaging attacker steps back with one foot, spins clockwise and strikes the opponent in front of him with his right hand for base damaging damage, -10SM. John has +DC for style making it dangerous, 2 intensities of damage landed. Lauren continues with 77, 56, one more hit.

    Incidentally, John, I don't usually give out skill improvements to base combat skills during combat, because I don't want to have to change the target numbers more than necessary. I've already done the addition and written it down, and if I check back I don't want to have to check also whether that number was calculated before or after the skill improvement. I have done it, but only if there's good reason to think I'll be able to keep clear which number is correct.

    --M. J. Young

    Mon Jul 20 2009 12:37 am #
14. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    OK MJ, I didn't realize that about the skill improvements. It's totally understood. I didn't mean "Did I get the new use?" I meant more like "Am I going to get the new use?" Sorry for the misunderstanding.

    (Doing Therapy)

    Mon Jul 20 2009 12:43 am #
15. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    Got it. Yes, I think I'll give it to you, in both skills, mostly because if I don't I'll never hear the end of it.....

    I keep telling myself that I have to step away from this and go make dinner, so I probably will just as soon as I note here that I've got open threads from Brock, Maxx, Harry, Scott, and John 2.

    I'm going to give Brock at least one more day to get oriented and ask questions, although after that I'll probably resort to GE rolls to see how much time he has based on what he decides to do.

    Among other things, Maxx is looking for an answer to prayers that are being prayed as practice; I've rolled a 12 GE roll, which is good enough, so he's going to get something. We'll also jump forward a week to Day 91.

    Of course it figures that when Harry decides to create an enhanced version of his read minds skill to increase his chance of success, he would roll 18, low enough that the ordinary version would have worked. But we'll give him the 1@1 Reliable Read Surface Thoughts P1@1 one minute of concentration with closed eyes gives +32SM to read minds attempt.

    I seem to recall that Scott rolled a very strong success roll--right, it was like 96 or something--so that means that Alice is going to be feeling better than she's felt in a long time.

    John 2 is still fighting, and wants to try another maneuver.

    --M. J. Young

    Tue Jul 21 2009 3:18 am #
16. 

    WilliamTWodium
    Member

    Among other things, Maxx is looking for an answer to prayers that are being prayed as practice; I've rolled a 12 GE roll, which is good enough, so he's going to get something.

    And that's the mechanic I needed. Thanks. I might have decided on that eventually, but cribbing it from you is faster.

    Tue Jul 21 2009 3:33 am #
17. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    So glad to have been of help. The GE roll allows you to get very good and very bad results in practice, yet keep it "practice".

    Now, let's see what's happening with Maxx, Harry, Scott, John 2, and Graeme.

    I am adding skills to Maxx' paper:

    • 2@5 Computer Programming T11@1 C++, Java, Javascript, PHP, Matlab, Visual Basic and a few more, with experience in Action Script, Perl, Prolog (for AI), BASIC and several others; also includes virtual or augmented reality, integration of hardware interface, mapping, object recognition and visual augmentation.
    • 2@4 Modify Computer T11@3 includes virtual or augmented reality, integration of hardware interface with mapping, object recognition and visual augmentation.
    • 2@5 Repair Computer T11@4 including limited PCB, electrical stuff such as servomotor and others.
    • 2@3 Build Computer T11@5 VHDL to program FPGA (such as making a scientific calculator)

    Those go on Maxx' sheet, not the sprite's.

    I must remember that he is exercising, as this will increase his strength and agility before he is born, although it will take some time to do so. Moving him forward a week at a time now, we jump to Day 98, the end of fourteen weeks.

    I sort of anticipated that Harry would tackle the interrogation now that he's tapped into the suspect's mind. He has 18 minutes, of which he has consumed between three and five already just getting things organized, but that leaves him a quarter of an hour to prompt mental responses.

    Scott is about to get into a pillow fight; he rolls 7 on an intuition check and so is not surprised (in the technical sense) by the incoming pillow; but a 24 is well outside both his agility and his hand/eye, so he didn't grab it.

    John 2 is focusing on maneuvers.

    New use determinations are made largely by referee discretion, based in significant part on how varied the uses of the skill are. Since Graeme's concealment skill is very narrow in scope, I'm going to allow a significantly open range of possible distinct uses--a flying machine as distinct from a ground vehicle will count, as will use against the Roman. Tracking two people, though, will be a new use for the scrying skill, not for the protection.

    That means I've got to make some rolls. He wants to protect the hovercraft, that's a roll of 18 for the protection and an increase in his SAL to 1@3; his scrying rolls (five times) are 79, 65, 49, 30, 70, against a 63% chance of success. Now he puts a second person into the still-protected craft and attempts the scry again, 95, 51, 93, 56, 89, again two successes, and an increase in his scrying SAL to 1@3. He has to recast it on the guard, 58 fails, so the Azmayincan rolls his detect 21, 63, 73, 92, 37. I would give him the improvement on the protection, but he did not succeed. He can of course try it again.

    --M. J. Young

    Tue Jul 21 2009 11:24 pm #
18. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    It's going to be a late night, because I've got to go do something else and come back; but I am going to begin by listing out the players: Brock, Maxx, Harry, Scott, John 2, and Graeme.

    I can give Brock some information even though I don't know quite what he knows.

    I've figured out what it is about Maxx' intended audio triangulation skill that's making it difficult for me to assess; I'll relate the complications to him, and let him decide how to proceed with it.

    Harry is unsure about his interrogating skills, but we'll use his wonderings as questions and see where it gets him. He's reading the mind while asking the questions, so he gets two lines of information.

    We'll take Scott through this pillow fight quickly. The consequence is already part of the previous roll, really, as it doesn't matter who "wins".

    John 2 is going to go another minute with Lauren, so let's roll initiative then attacks: 34, 36, Lauren, 55, 82; John 92; Lauren 10, 30. I'm wondering about that 92; but that's not a botch.

    And really, I hate these mock combat bits, as they don't seem to serve much purpose to me, so since he wants to finish it up, it will end now.

    Graeme is not doing well on this cloaking bit; he rolls 86 this time, and so does not cloak the guard. The Azmayincan rolls 48, 60, 36, 03, 56, all successes. He gets a 16 GE roll on the body of water, and it strikes me that modern prisons probably do not have bathtubs, and it seems unlikely that a future prison would need one--except that this is a Roman setting, so there is likely to be a Roman Bath for the Roman guards.

    I think it unlikely in the extreme for Roman guards to have any magic at all, and particularly not top-bias (7@) informations; but a GE of 9 is pretty solid.

    I'm really past my deadline, but I'm wrapping up now, so I guess I'm good.

    --M. J. Young

    Thu Jul 23 2009 3:20 am #
19. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    And really, I hate these mock combat bits, as they don't seem to serve much purpose to me, so since he wants to finish it up, it will end now.

    I really enjoy them. These have been the highlight of this world.

    And when did I say I wanted to finish it up? I said I wanted Lauren to mention the spinning backhand punch when we were finished. If we're not finished for another 20 posts, well then, I guess she won't mention it until then.

    Thu Jul 23 2009 3:22 am #
20. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Two Posts

    Speaking of the mock combat, it suddenly occurs to me that, up until this point, I would have been fighting without any boxing gloves. I learned the skill bare handed in Pearl Harbor. I trained William bare handed. Fighting Lauren is bare handed. That would mean that, wearing boxing gloves would be a new use, wouldn't it? You can't tell me that having a 3 pound glove on each hand wouldn't affect things at all. I would have NEVER worn boxing gloves before this point. If I fought with gloves, it would be a new use, wouldn't it?

    Thu Jul 23 2009 4:55 pm #
21. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    John, I don't know, but it's a moot point--since boxing is illegal in this world, it's unlikely that you will find any boxing gloves.

    I must be early; only Maxx, Harry, and John 2 are here, and John 2 posted yesterday.

    When they are fully developed, auditory perception and pitch discrimination skills will reach 1@8 on average; those are the skills Maxx needs to focus on speech outside the womb, and they are a long way from that 1@8 level. On the other hand, he is practicing them, so they will be above average when he emerges. On yet another hand (and I often have these octopoid multi-armed discussions about these kinds of things) he is trying to overcome a very difficult opposing environment. Yet on yet another hand he has a mental skill in this connection, in addition to his body skill. Yet it is difficult to know how to handle it. If he cannot hear it, he cannot process it. I think under the circumstances, a successful roll on his 1@9 Focus Senses P3@0 sensitivity variant enables sorting specific auditory or other sensory information from background should give him +RS/10 on his Pitch Discrimination skill, which at present is around 0@4 Pitch Discrimination B0@6, and his body bias is also 0@, so his base chance of success on the bod skill is his 1@8 will power BRA+0@4 SAL=22%, but his psionic skill has a 1@9 SAL 1@ bias, and 1@9 BRA, which is 40%. But he wants to do this as practice, so we'll use the GE roll and note that his chance of succeeding is something around twenty-five percent, which a check of my charts tells me is something between a 12 and a 13 on a GE roll, so let's roll: he gets 18.

    He also rolls 57 on his attempt to process vibration hitting his hand into audio. That's clearly a failure, but I'm going to do the math so it's clear to everyone else. The skill he is attempting is a P5@1 Altered Sensation--the ability to use one set of sensory nerves to process data to a different information set, in this case processing tactile as auditory. That 5@1 bias gives him a -51 penalty to overcome in attempting to teach himself this trick. He has no example or teacher, so this is entirely on him to devise how to do it and teach himself. He gets his BRA, which for psionics is 1@9, or +19, and his own bias which is 1@1 for +11, and the bias level of the world, which I'm calling 15@, for +15. That makes +45 against -51, which puts him at -6% chance of success at this. That's also an 11% chance to botch, so any roll of 90 or higher would be a botch at this, but he is not near the danger zone.

    Of course, he also has his ordinary stereo direction sense, using his ears, which will if successful tell him which direction her heart is. That, though, is less developed, probably 0@3, which makes this a 21% chance of success, and we'll roll that: 90 fails.

    It occurs to me that a GE roll might do Harry some good, so I'll roll it. I'm suddenly interested in whether this might be someone who faced him at sea at some time in the past. No, 6-7-8 is 21, bad enough, so this is not going quite so well as I would have liked.

    John 2 is getting wild in his attack, and that's always bad, from what I've been told. He is charging at Lauren and screaming obscenities as he does so. My reaction (which is usually good for her) is to raise her 2@10 P10@1 force shield, which in this 10@ world with her 2@8 will power has a 78% chance of working; whether or not it does, she will also use her 2@7 B4@8 Evasive Tumbling, also with a 2@8 BRA but 2x7@ bias. Rolling the first, I've got 22; the second is 30, which comes as a sit-mod against his chance of success for the minute. Those are both instant activation defenses, so absent surprise she gets to raise them before initiative is rolled. We roll that next, 43, 74, since his chance to hit went way down with the new -52 defensive modifiers, he's not getting a hit. She foregoes her first attacks because the shield is between them and instead rolls out of the way. He rolls 93, which with his current reduced chance to hit is a botch. She comes back with 03, 15, two more taps.

    --M. J. Young

    Thu Jul 23 2009 10:41 pm #
22. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    John, I don't know, but it's a moot point--since boxing is illegal in this world, it's unlikely that you will find any boxing gloves.

    No, but padded, martial arts gloves DO exists, and they would serve the purpose just the same. And you say I don't think.....

    And I wasn't screaming. If you heard it, it was more like a war cry.

    Fri Jul 24 2009 12:37 am #
23. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    I have reached the game threads, he said to himself with some surprise. Let me see what I can do for Maxx, Harry, and John 2, before heading out for the weekend.

    I like the suggested middle name, Orlanda, for a variety of reasons. It is an interesting mesh of Orlina and Alanda, his parents' middle names; also, the last character in this scenario (a fictional scenario on which I am basing this) had the middle name Toreinu, and having a different middle name would be good for distinguishing the two characters. So without rolling I'm going with Orlanda.

    We will move him forward another two weeks, to Day 112, the end of week 16. That gives him these physical attributes:

    0@3 Strength
    0@6 Stamina
    0@8 Resistance
    0@9 Density
    2@1 Flexibility
    0@3 Agility
    0@4 Hand/Eye

    I think Harry has gotten a big breakthrough on his interrogation, but his mind reading is coming to the end of its duration, so he'd better make the best of it.

    If Lauren is going to show off for John 2, I should make her roll for it. 40 on her psionic slicer is an easy success. Now I need something she can slice; 12 on a GE roll is good enough.

    --M. J. Young

    Sat Jul 25 2009 1:21 am #
24. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    I've just come from the character generation thread for a new player, but I've got two active players, Maxx and John 2.

    Maxx has thrown a curve my direction, as his simple self-hypnosis suddenly has the property of enabling him to "alleviate pain if any is present", kicking it up from a simple P1@0 Hypnotism variant to a P6@1 Reduce Pain. I'd like to split the two effects and reject the second, because I think he can learn the first easily enough but has to build toward the second with intervening skills. He has an example of self-hypnosis, but it is for feeling good and not for combating pain. I'll follow my instincts on this, and roll 38, which will give him a 1@1 Self-Hypnosis P1@0 causes character to feel positive, but will ignore the part about pain for the moment. We'll also move forward four weeks to day 140/week 20, because that's the moment when all the things for which Maxx has been hoping start to happen.

    His physical attributes are now:

    0@4 Strength
    0@7 Stamina
    0@9 Resistance
    0@9 Density
    1@10 Flexibility
    0@4 Agility
    0@6 Hand/Eye

    John 2 thinks he can cleverly manipulate the dialog so that I will have to tell him what I said he couldn't possibly know. I can manipulate dialog, too.

    --M. J. Young

    Mon Jul 27 2009 12:25 am #
25. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Edited, explained below.

    Mon Jul 27 2009 1:30 am #
26. 

    WilliamTWodium
    Member

    MJ, how many times do I have to say it?

    Once, usually. If it didn't work the first time, repeating it won't help.

    Mon Jul 27 2009 2:01 am #
27. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Scott, I intended to delete that.

    Mon Jul 27 2009 2:41 am #
28. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Two Posts

    You're always saying that we should ask mechanics questions Behind the Screens, so here goes.

    If wearing boxing gloves (or the equivalent) would be a new use on boxing, then it would be a new use on all boxing-related skills, wouldn't it? So, if I threw a spinning backhand punch with gloves, that would also be a new use. Since I taught that to myself whilst blind, doing it when I can see would be a new use. (Now that I think of it, doing it with gloves whilst I can see should be 2 new uses in one) Or would I have to mention that I did it twice and get 2 different rolls? Well, whatever, I'm going to do it.

    So, wearing gloves and being able to see should take the Spinning Backhand punch to 1@3 from 1@1.

    Should give my 4th new use on boxing (I've never boxed with gloves on)

    And what they hey, do the surrender thing with gloves on too, for yet another new use on that.

    What if I threw a spinning backhand slap? (Same thing, just open-handed instead of closed fist) Would that be a new use or a new skill? Probably a new skill. (Sorry, I've just found new uses to be the easiest way to advance at the 1@ level)

    I like new uses!!!!!!

    Mon Jul 27 2009 2:46 am #
29. 

    WilliamTWodium
    Member

    Scott, I intended to delete that.

    Sorry. I suppose you still can, if you'd like.

    Mon Jul 27 2009 4:31 am #
30. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    I was intending to argue my point, because I really do think that I made my case quite well about how my character could find out that Lauren could see using completely in character knowledge. However, I've found arguing with MJ is like arguing with a brick wall, so I intended to delete it. Scott replied, I couldn't delete it. Scott apparently gave me permission to delete it, so I did.

    Mon Jul 27 2009 4:49 am #
31. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    Your argument concerning new use for gloves has almost persuaded me that gloves should not be a new use, because you're going to abuse them.

    But to simplify things, I do not generally allow new use for combinations. That is, it might be a new use for doing something in the dark and it might be a new use for doing something with gloves on, but it would never be also a new use for doing something with gloves on in the dark. Also, I tend to think that new use for gloves when boxing means that you've used up the new use for gloves across the board--my reasoning here is that you've learned the difference between wearing and not wearing gloves when you fight, and that difference transfers automatically to everything you do when you fight, so you get the bonus to the one skill but not to any of the others.

    Really, I expect new use bonuses to be creative, not mechanical. I give you the credit not because you've done something different, but because you've realized that you can do something you did not realize before. Once you've used gloves to fight, you've proved to yourself that you can use gloves to fight, so you get the credit on the one skill you used for that (probably boxing) and we strike it off the list of new ideas you can have, because you've already had that idea.

    New use was created to allow people who never practice or train to advance their skills through use in actual adventuring. It does permit people to experiment with new ways to use a skill and advance that way, but that's not really its function, and doing it that way is against the point. So for example if you learned your spinning backhand punch in practice, and then you used it in combat in the dark against a ghoul, I would allow that it was a new use because when you needed to do something new you thought of a new way to use an old skill. But you learned it in the dark here, in practice, so if you want a new use you're going to have to use it in a situation that requires you to do something different--and using it in the light is not really different, because you already know you can do it whether or not you can see, so the fact that you can see doesn't change things.

    Thanks for helping me think that through.

    Harry and John 2 are today's players. I note that the thread with Brock on it has been quiet, and I hope nothing has happened to him; but for all that, I'm not really rushing it, because I'm probably going to drop our new player Van-Eric into that world when we've finished his character creation, and that's moving along nicely but will take at least a few more days.

    Whether non-player characters act the way you hope they will is usually determined by a GE roll--and Harry gets a 12, Good Enough, and has explained what he hopes will happen, so he'll get something like that.

    Lauren rolls 08 on the skill projection, and John 2 rolls 36 on learning 1@1 Clairgustation P3@7. He also wants to teach himself a steal initiative skill that goes from hands raised to boxing stance. I'm not going to limit it quite that much, but make it a simple "snap to stance steal initiative" maneuver, and roll 66 which is going to require that I crunch some numbers. His bod bias is from the 7@5 Missile Catch, and his target skill is 7@1, and he's got the world's 15@ bod area bias and his own 1@9 BRA, 109-71=38% chance of success, he did not learn it this time.

    I was really hoping that these gloves were not going to be a reality, but he rolled a GE of 15, not unfavorable result, so they've got to exist.

    I'm gone.

    --M. J. Young

    Tue Jul 28 2009 12:10 am #
32. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Your argument concerning new use for gloves has almost persuaded me that gloves should not be a new use, because you're going to abuse them.

    So, just answer yes or no, since I'm not totally certain. Would gloves be a new use on boxing or not? If it's a new use on boxing, that's good enough for me.

    And no, I wasn't trying to abuse the privilege, I just thought I found a treasure trove of new uses. Tell me you wouldn't jump on something like that. You've made your point very well, and it's cool.

    Tue Jul 28 2009 4:20 am #
33. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Two Posts

    As I'm sure you're aware, there are many, many different styles of boxing. I probably learned modern-day boxing. The style that Mike Tyson would use. Suppose that I landed in a world which was 1920s earth. The prevalent boxing style would be bare-knuckle boxing. Completely different. You keep your hands lower when going into stance, and it relies more on uppercut punches and the like. (If I'm not mistaken) Would learning a completely different boxing style be a new use, new skill, or would it be training in the same thing?

    That was probably the best call that Adam made when running me. I wanted to learn boxing in real-life. I've never been able to throw a punch to save my life. Now I'm almost a professional at it.

    Tue Jul 28 2009 5:35 am #
34. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    Concerning whether or not gloves would be a new use, I'm afraid my referee answer is, "How would you know?" And since I don't have to make that decision until the situation arises, I don't have to know either.

    The same answer applies to the other boxing styles. I would have to decide at that time whether you were getting training in a style you already know or learning another one. I am inclined to think that it would be training.

    Now I see that Brock is back, and Maxx, Harry, and John 2 are here. There's also a new post in Graeme's thread, but it's not Graeme--I'm hoping it's not Spam, but I unapproved two other posts from the same poster because they seemed to be about promoting his game here, so I'm awaiting some kind of reply to this one.

    Brock is going to examine the cave.

    I'm trying to decide whether Maxx gets a bonus on his meditation if he touches his head with his hand while attempting to do it, and he makes a good argument; I roll 35 on his attempt to meditate that way, noting his 1@1 SAL, 2x1@ bias, and 1@9 BRA, all of which makes 32, but I think that adding a focus to it would give +5 (it's only his hand, not an external object), so I'll note that he has a new use and that he gets +5 for touching his hand to his head for a focus. It's now 1@2 SAL.

    I think that the chance of precisely locating Morani's mind is about one in a thousand, but I'll allow that a GE of 5 or lower would mean he found the right spot--and then he would have to roll for a successful mind reading skill use to tag it. He rolls 20, which is just bad enough and suggests that something goes wrong.

    I should have advanced the calendar, but there's so much going on on the board today that I didn't think of it until I'd closed the thread, so I'll do that next time.

    Harry is now being given an army (albeit a small one) with which to take the pirates aboard their harbored ship. Let's see what he does with it.

    John 2 is working from a 15 GE roll on the gloves, and wants to find them on the ship, and is enlisting Derek's aid on this. Derek rolls 06 on his computer use skill, so he'll come up with something. He is going to attempt his steal init again, 99 is a botch, and I think I'll go with the bod botch injury table this time: he rolls 14, Unconscious for d100/5 minutes, damaging level injury. His d100 roll is 12, so that's three minutes.

    --M. J. Young

    Wed Jul 29 2009 12:02 am #
35. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    I've just finished a long post on skills in the character generation thread, and I see one of the largest gaming groups here in a while. Let me welcome Brock, Maxx, Harry, Scott, John 2, and Graeme to the table.

    Brock has begun a potentially hazardous expedition.

    Maxx is trying something new, and this time I must remember to move his calendar forward from Day 140/Week 20 to Week 24. He wants to use movement to enhance psionics, which is a good idea except that his movement is limited by his current physical attributes, which are:
    0@5 Strength
    0@8 Stamina
    0@10 Resistance
    0@10 Density
    1@5 Flexibility
    0@5 Agility
    0@6 Hand/Eye

    I am now going to pit Harry persuasion, bonused from 1@9 to 2@4 by the fact that he has the authorities on his side, against the pirate officer's will power, bonused from 1@10 to 2@4 by virtue of the loyal men he has on his side and the fact that he probably suspects the death sentence. It's a pair of difficult persuasion checks, with Harry rolling (d30+10=) 35 and the pirate 37, a stalemate for the moment.

    Scott is wondering whether Alice' reaction to him is entirely based on his recent magic or something building over time. I'm really not sure she knows the answer to that.

    John 2 is recalling a magic skill. I'm not certain whether it's within the curve; I'll have to check that. (Actually, on reflection I'm pretty sure it is.) More significantly, though, I have to check a detail. He doesn't need to pray, because he's not injured; and he posted that he won't pray if he's not seriously injured, so we'll cancel the prayer.

    I'm going to allow that the use of gloves is a new use; that requires him to roll for success, and his roll is 71, which is too high for him to get into proper form.

    Graeme is not having much luck with this cloaking spell--he rolls 95 on cloaking the Roman guard, when his chance of success is 2x7@ world area bias+2@2 BRA+1@3 SAL+1SM=50%, which is 5% chance to botch, that close to a botch but not quite.

    I will give him the salad bowl gratis. I will ask him what argument he intends to make to get his reticent Roman prisoner reveal his secrets.

    --M. J. Young

    Thu Jul 30 2009 1:24 am #
36. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    I think the MAG bias in this world is 0@25, isn't it? That's also part of the reason I didn't want to do it if I didn't have to. Too high chance to botch.

    (Doing Therapy)

    Thu Jul 30 2009 4:46 am #
37. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    Two Posts

    Ya know, I just had a thought. Could your intentions when performing the same skill be a new use? My first time throwing the spinning backhand punch, I was trying to learn it, and throwing it blind. Of course, I threw it full force. Now, my character isn't throwing it full force, he's trying to control it. Trying to learn to do it better. Probably a case where botches would be hurting Lauren much worse than I intend to. Could my intentions in the case be a new use? Just wondering.

    (Doing Therapy)

    Thu Jul 30 2009 4:56 am #
38. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    No.

    For anyone who is curious, I did put together a Parkour Skill Package, in the most recent post in the character generation thread. I had thought of posting it in its own thread, possibly in more manageable form, but I'm pretty frazzled tonight and just want to get through the rest of the work as quickly as possible.

    That includes game threads from Maxx, Harry, and John 2.

    We will advance Maxx to week 28, which improves his physical attributes a bit more:

    0@6 Strength
    0@9 Stamina
    1@1 Resistance
    1@1 Density
    1@1 Flexibility
    0@6 Agility
    0@6 Hand/Eye

    I'm going to adjust those numbers at birth, because it's too difficult for me to track which ones are different from the book values during the gestation process--that is, if I gave him an extra intensity of strength I might lose it the next time the book gives him increases in strength.

    I'll give Harry credit for changing the circumstances and will roll another comparative attribute contest: 24 for him, 35 for the opponent, and he still failed (just) but is making them very nervous. He's got a simple persuasion check of 17, which is a strong success for his 1@9 attribute (this is persuading the redshirts, so he doesn't get the bonus for having them on his side), and I'm going to follow it with a 2d10+1 GE roll: 11, which is Good but Below Expectations. I'll have to see that spell.

    John 2 seems to think he has Lauren at his beck and call, which is not at all like her. He also is arguing about the application of a rule that applies at my discretion, so I'm not reading that part to intently.

    --M. J. Young

    Fri Jul 31 2009 2:05 am #
39. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    John 2 seems to think he has Lauren at his beck and call, which is not at all like her.

    No MJ, this is actually the next day. I went ahead a day in the last post or two. I'm not going to fight Lauren twice in the same day.

    He also is arguing about the application of a rule that applies at my discretion, so I'm not reading that part to intently.

    Not arguing, asking. I just want to get to 2@1 boxing. You said you don't like these mock fights, let me have the new use at the beginning of the fight, and this will be the last, at least for a while. I was thinking it might be more convenient for you. Once I'm at 2@1, I'll be happy, at least for the minute.

    It's like I said in that email, I think it's a symptom of your particular mental illness to see everything in a negative light, or to snipe in on the one bad thing in a bucketful of good things.

    Fri Jul 31 2009 2:13 am #
40. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    I'm starting with Brock, Maxx, Harry, and John 2.

    Brock and Scott are back in discussion.

    Maxx is pretty fixed on reaching Morani's mind before birth, which should not be possible. A GE roll of 8, though, says he gets the opportunity to target Morani's mind, but a 49 skill check is a failure still.

    Harry has sketched a new skill. If I understand what he's asking, I've got to shift the +32SM by -50 for five halvings of the time, and taken another -10 penalty for an added skill, which I will have to investigate first to see whether it can be done under the current bias and second whether it significantly impacts the base parameters any (such as increasing the base TF or decreasing the base duration). But first let's confirm that this is what he wants to attempt.

    Lauren rolls 89 on the attempt to imprint the skill pattern for Clairtacticity, which is a failure on the imprint. She also rolls 86 on the teaching skill, which is also a failure. John 2 will have to decide what he wants to do.

    --M. J. Young

    Sat Aug 1 2009 1:57 am #
41. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    I have just launched Van-Eric in Brock's thread, so let me turn my attention to Maxx, Harry, and John 2.

    I should push Maxx forward another month, to week 32. His physical attributes are now

    0@7 Strength
    0@10 Stamina
    1@2 Resistance
    1@1 Density
    0@10 Flexibility
    0@7 Agility
    0@7 Hand/Eye

    Some of those are "birth normal" but will increase slightly because of the exercise he was doing.

    We've got a few more months to go, so we'll probably be born this week. Won't that be fun?

    With some help from Scott, we have a spell ready for Harry's approval or revision.

    John 2 needs the definition of a term. Simple enough.

    --M. J. Young

    Sun Aug 2 2009 8:33 pm #
42. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    Van-Eric and Brock are in the same world, and I've got threads with Maxx, Harry, John 2, and Graeme.

    I'm putting Van-Eric close to the two versers present, but since their intuition checks are 28 and 25 I don't think either of them notices--but I'll flag Scott on the matter. Oh, Iggy gets a roll: 9, which is certainly good enough for a sentient iguana.

    We'll move forward to week 36 for Maxx.

    Harry's new skill is designed. I'll copy it here, but first let me roll for success, two flourishes are necessary and he rolls 15 and 25, both successes. Now for the skill learning: 74 is questionable but not impossible. He has his +20 sit-mod, 2@3 BRA, 3@1 bias, +13 for 2@6 religion, and +10 for alliance, minus the 2@2 bias of the target skill. That makes 65% chance of success, so he failed.

    I seem to be having a hard time remembering all the things I need to say in that thread; I don't suppose it could be because of the person in the other room trying to interrupt me constantly.

    John 2 is trying to beat the system again; also, he hasn't answered a previously asked question.

    Graeme needs to cloak the guard and the boat, I'll roll those both first: 54, 18. It's a 50% chance of success on the cloak, so the guard is not shielded but the boat is. On the detect, he rolls 16, which is below the threshhold, 27 which is a success, 25, 43, 29.

    He rolls 35 against 27 on the persuasion-versus-will power contest with the Roman.

    That's that for now.

    --M. J. Young

    Wed Aug 5 2009 2:19 am #
43. 

    JohnA1nut
    Member

    John 2 is trying to beat the system again

    You try to push my boundaries with the game. I see it only fitting that I push the boundaries of the game...

    (Doing Therapy)

    Wed Aug 5 2009 2:24 am #
44. 

    M. J. Young
    Moderator

    I see that Van-Eric posted; hopefully Brock's computer problems will not keep him away too long, and Scott will interact as he is able. Meanwhile, Maxx, Harry, and John 2 are also waiting.

    We'll give Van-Eric a quick description of the camp and hopefully a conversation will begin soon.

    The question for Maxx is whether he is born a bit early or a bit late or close to the right time. I'm inclined just to have him born around week 38, which means that two more weeks would pass; the GE roll is 16, so we're good to go on a normal birth time and position. I'm going to delay rolling for the telepathic contact, because I don't know whether he's still going to want to attempt it given the description of his circumstances.

    Harry had a question about the skill that didn't work, but I don't think it matters at this point.

    John 2 gets the prize for making the referee laugh, and he rolls 83 on an attempt to learn clairtacticity--not a botch, but not a success either, I think. But let's check to be certain, because he does have an instructor and teacher, +14 for instructor (2@8 BRA), +25 for teaching (2@5 SAL), +10 for world bias, his own (2@2) BRA for +22, and his own (5@10) bias for +60, -38 for the 3@8 target skill =93 or close enough, that's a success for 1@3 Clairtacticity (unspecified) P3@8.

    --M. J. Young

    Wed Aug 5 2009 9:32 pm #
45. 

    Brock
    Member

    I am attempting to show up every other day, at least. The library isn't THAT far away, it's just I have other things to do and only 1 hour of computer time a day.

    Fri Aug 7 2009 1:57 am #

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