MJ's insightful explanation of how Animal Magnetism can win you a chess game (which can be found over in Bias of M/MI use, games, second post) got me thinking about how much is wrapped up in An-Mag, which in turn made me consider that perhaps I don't know Multiverser's social attributes as well as I should. So, as a starting point for useful and informative discussion, I put to you the following question:
How would you rate the Beast, of Disney's famed animated feature Beauty and the Beast, on the three social attributes - Persuasion, Charisma, and An-Mag?
I'm hoping you guys' responses will help tease out where we draw the lines between the attributes, showing which traits we consider relevant to which. I'll hold back my own rating for the time being.
Readysetgo!
Well, your eyes play a large part of someone's animal magnetism. I mean if a woman is gorgeous, knows it, and knows how to use it, nobody cares if she is a total witch. To a blind person, all they know is the way the person talks. If I were blind, I think I would find The Beast's Animal Magnetism to be high. (On a side note, for a challenge, try explaining 4th of July fireworks to a person who has been blind all of their life.)
Without seeing him, The Beast has high animal magnetism, and high charisma. Those drop when you see his appearance. His persuasion could increase if you did see him though. I mean have him say "Go get me a glass of water" in a polite voice, but with those teeth bared, I bet most people would do what he said.
I had a date with a young lady that I met through a friend. Her father was a Hell's Angel biker. He came out, smiled, shook my hand, and said, as calmly as if we were talking about the weather "I just wanted to meet you, so I know who to hunt down and kill if she comes home crying." Calm and polite as if we were talking about the weather. Needless to say, that was my first and last date with that lady.
So, in short, to a blind person, I would give high animal magnetism, and high charisma to The Beast. To a sighted person, those drop some, but persuasion hits the ceiling.
I think that the Beast's initial demeanor is very gruff and "off-putting", and that anyone (sighted or not) would have an initial bad reaction to him. This is not exactly because he is a hairy creature with a mane--I think Wookies and Yazirians would also find him initially unattractive, because he has that harsh exterior. Also, although he certainly has confidence in some ways, he is entirely lacking in social confidence. That, in fact, is the reason he is in this mess, because he lacks social grace. Put another way, his transformation into the beast did not lower his animal magnetism, because he was already a beast to everyone he met. No one's initial reaction would be favorable regardless of whether he was the handsome prince or the hairy beast.
He is more charismatic than that, although not terribly above average. He is bumbling through his relationship with Belle. One wonders a bit whether the blustery exterior was there to hide the lack of confidence within. He does not know how to relate to people--but it is something that Belle is teaching him, so to some degree we are watching his charisma improve over the course of the film.
John is right about the persuasion, though: even if he asked nicely, you would hesitate to argue. What is again interesting is I think this would have been the case before he was a beast, when he was a wealthy nobleman. He rests confident in who he is when he wants something done, lets his temper flash, makes it clear that disagreeing with him has consequences. It is Belle's own stubborn will power that enables her to oppose him and change him. I would give him a 2@ persuasion, because he is a commanding individual in any form. I also think that a blind man would be as impressed as anyone else by the determination in this creature.
Yes, appearance has something to do with it, but I do not agree that cross-species differences have that much impact on these scores. A girl can see the beauty in a horse, so I know it's there. Snakes do not look ugly because they look ugly, but because their appearance is associated with their very alien lack of emotion, and the ability to inspire empathy is part of the whole animal magnetism package.
Does that help?
--M. J. Young
I had fallen under the impression that "confidence" was associated primarily with An-Mag. Perhaps it would be more accurate to say that confidence in one's convictions is part of Persuasion, confidence in oneself is part of An-Mag, and confidence in one's friends is part of Charisma.
Does that help?
Immensely. "Fearsome," then, as a descriptor, is usually indicative of a lower An-Mag and a higher Persuasion. Someone who rules through fear likely has a high Persuasion and a low Charisma, with An-Mag being irrelevant to the group dynamic.
Would it be possible to employ a high An-Mag to maintain a position of leadership or control? If so, how would that work?
I understand that in general An-Mag works on first meetings and Charisma operates over the long term. In what situations would you use Charisma to govern an interaction between strangers, or An-Mag between old friends?
SCOTT WROTE:
Would it be possible to employ a high An-Mag to maintain a position of leadership or control? If so, how would that work?
Adolf Hitler did just that. Ever listen to one of his speeches? You can't understand a word he is saying, but yet you want to listen to it. He was very charismatic as a person, which got him going, and probably got him out of a lot of jams in his life.
I think the use of an-mag for leadership is leadership by manipulation.
Think of the girl who is cute and coy and can always get a guy to do what she asks. She might not even by a "nice" person. At some point this is overlapping into persuasion, but the an-mag aspect is certainly significant. Notice that with this person, no one would say she was in charge, no one would label her the leader, no one would even think that she made the decisions--but she's pulling the strings all the same.
Thus we can see that these three personality scores can each represent a different "leadership style". A person with an outstanding score in any one of them can run the show, but he (or she) will do so in distinct ways.
--M. J. Young