Maxximum Reality: Maxx Starts Play · Page 13

Actually, it would also be a failure if the world bias level were not at least 11@, which is entirely possible given everything that's happened up to this point. (A bias of P10@10, for example, would allow all the skills you've performed, and none of your skill checks since achieving a personal bias of higher than 10@ have been within four points of failure.) It's good that you mentioned it, though, because I didn't even notice the sit-mod and so I didn't bother doing the math (as I'm sure you saw). I checked the Detect for time factor and sit-mod, and then I guess I just assumed the other skill was the same way.

However, the reason that sit-mod is there is because the time factor is four minutes (a fact I also overlooked), so everything happens as I've said except that Oo-hii's question comes a minute into the prep period instead of just after your failure.

"I wonder what you meant by *easy-prey* considering in this form hardly anything could notice me. I also did not know you can use your intuition freely that you can choose to try it manually or leave it on auto-mode. I wonder how far you can detect if you really try."

::But I can notice you. And I don't have to try. That tells me you're *easy-prey*. Your tricks are no good against me.::

"I am still searching for the thing to seal the rift."

::Then tell me what it is, and I'll find it!::

The telepathy is mildly distracting.

Once you know the needle's location, what do you do? (And what do you do differently if that location ends up being "in Oo-hii's hand"?)

____
Detect Materials now reads:

1@4 Detect Materials P3@4 (known patterns: seed mush, fabric, air, water, food in various condition, hair, saliva, steel)

We'll do it this way: any material you are obviously familiar with but which is not on this list is detectable at a penalty. Materials on the list are detected without penalty. Materials are only added to list if they are examined with the possibility of future detection in mind. The way I know whether you character had the skill in mind or not is whether or not you say so: if you didn't mention it, your character wasn't thinking about it.

The reason it matters is because I'm assuming the kind of examination required differs in some way from the ordinary - otherwise, it wouldn't matter whether you examined the material before or after you learned the skill. Since it does, that means you have to examine the material with this purpose in mind. I've giving you the needle as a freebie, but from now on no material goes on the list without being examined expressly for that purpose. On the plus side, anything you forget to actually examine is still detectable, just with more difficulty.

Can I say that I will examine anything that interests me in that event so I do not have to mention it later such as if the thing that interests me in that event is metal needle and I have the chance to examine it then it will be automatically noted as known material?

Maybe if I were a computer. I am not. I will forget. You will need to remind me in each case - and if you forget to remind me, you must have forgotten to do it. See above.

(If this were something like, "I load my pistol every morning and empty it every night," then sure, we could do that, and if I forgot, that wouldn't mean it didn't happen. This case is not like that, though.)

How much time have passed since spirit ejection?

I've done an accounting of time and made a note. Your character knows it's been more than five minutes by the time he starts concentrating on the Perceive Density, but it's unlikely to have been more than twenty. If he needs a more precise number, I've heard that guessing is fun.

But I can notice you. And I don't have to try. That tells me you're *easy-prey*. Your tricks are no good against me.

"That just shows how good your intuition are."

Then tell me what it is, and I'll find it!

"A metal needle to seal the rift. I hope you do not have an allergy to metal or something. You probably could detect it considering how intuitive you are."

And what do you do differently if that location ends up being "in Oo-hii's hand"?

I do not mind if Oo-hii grabs the needle if he does not mind touching metal. If I am not mistaken Oo-hii avoids touching metal if he has a choice but if he insists then I do not mind.

Once you know the needle's location, what do you do?

I will let Oo-hii grab it if he does not mind about touching metal. If he does mind I will probably move it telepathically if there is no obstruction. If there is an obstruction I will probably try to turn the needle in spirit form then bring it with me.

*****

Your character knows it's been more than five minutes by the time he starts concentrating on the Perceive Density, but it's unlikely to have been more than twenty.

That is good enough. Just for fun, let me guess 12 minutes?

"That just shows how good your intuition are."

There is no further argument on this point.

"A metal needle to seal the rift. I hope you do not have an allergy to metal or something. You probably could detect it considering how intuitive you are."

A pause.

::Never mind. Just hurry up.::

You finally finish activating your density perception, getting a very clear impression. It is not difficult to locate the needle (one of the densest things in the hollow, and with a distinctive shape). It is under a few things, but nothing that couldn't be shifted aside with telekinesis. You've never done it before, but the principle is not complex; before long, you have a mental grip on the needle and you've extracted it from its hiding place.

Now what?

_____
I'm assuming that moving an object "telepathically" amounts to telekinesis. Skill learning for simple object TK: 71, that's a lock with his bias:

1@2 Simple Object TK P4@2

No description necessary; variants of this skill are uncommon in my experience, and since Maxx didn't give specifics, I'm going with baselines for everything.

Just for fun, let me guess 12 minutes?

Twelve is indeed a number between five and twenty. Good job!

Never mind. Just hurry up.

I knew Oo-hii would be reluctant to touch the metal needle. Oh well, it is up to me then.

Now what?

I will go back out through the opening of the tree and bring the metal needle with me to the rift.

When I got back to the rift, I will start the ritual:
1) Try thought projection to surrounding objects (to the area that contained the force field) as universal language and/or ask anyone that have telepathy connection with me to chant with me in their own language if they wanted to.
2) Knock (or connect softly) the top of the force field using the back of the needle and project the thought of "Become the string to curve the material plane".
3) Fly around the rift repeatedly from the upper end to the lower end (forming a spiral downwards) and project the thought of "Unison surreality, Unison sew reality, Let us be in unison to fix the reality" repeatedly until I reach the lower end.
4) I will then point the sharp part of the needle to the lower end of the force field and say "Close the wound of reality, leave the traces spiritually" repeatedly until there is a reaction to the force field which would make it contract and curve the material plane to close the rift. This would theoretically leave a spiritual rift open but close the material plane rift.

*****

moving an object "telepathically" amounts to telekinesis

An interesting typo which reminds me of an idea I have of using telepathy to talk to surrounding to initiate magic. I probably should use the term "remotely" instead.

Okay, let's take this apart and figure out how it works. (The following numbered list makes no reference to the numbers used in your own numbered list.)

1) Am I correct in thinking that this ritual could be performed regardless of whether or not you were physically present?

2) Am I correct in thinking that the ritual will function regardless of whether or not entities in the area respond to your invitation to join the chant (or, indeed, whether or not any such entities are even present in the area), and thus that this is merely part of the verbal component of the ritual rather than any attempt to gain bonuses by involving multiple necessary participants?

3) Is it the case that your thought projection must successfully function in order for the ritual to succeed, or is the attempt at thought projection itself sufficient to allow the ritual a non-zero chance of success?

4) Would it be accurate to characterize your intended effect as an attempt to, without closing the gate between worlds, <me>manipulate space such that the two worlds connected by said gate have no physical contact with each other? Or, is that inaccurate, and in what way would the results of your successful ritual differ from that such that the inaccuracy matters in some hypothetical circumstance?

5) Keeping in mind that your motion and the needle's motion are, at this point, completely independent, does the needle also need to travel in a spiral around the force field / rift, or does it only need to tap the top and tap the bottom (with its position and/or activity in the meantime being unimportant to the ritual)?

6) How long do you expect this ritual to take? ("Until it works" is not an acceptable answer; how long do you expect it to take?) I would estimate this myself, but I don't know how tight a spiral you're traveling nor how long you spend chanting at the end.

7) Is it your intention that the effects will be permanent or temporary, and if temporary is there some factor you expect to define the duration other than "for a while" (as in, "until sunset," "until I stop concentrating on it," etc.)?

That's all the questions I have about the ritual for now.

Perhaps more importantly, it seems as though the force field is a crucial component of your spell, but Oo-hii has expressed an intent to be on the other side of the rift. Is it really your plan to close off physical access to the rift before he is able to cross over?

_____

Holding off on sharing my mechanical thoughts until my questions are answered. If they aren't the answers I expect, I'd have wasted my time posting irrelevant rulings.

Oh, but one thing: I might end up changing your telekinesis skill to a P4@3 Telekinesis of Obscured Objects, depending on how I end up treating your Perceive Density. Would you have any objection to that?

1) Am I correct in thinking that this ritual could be performed regardless of whether or not you were physically present?

Actually it could only be performed when I am spiritually present because only the spiritual me can confirm that a spiritual rift is still present after the ritual is finished. The material plane rift seal could be confirmed when the needle from lower end of the rift could go to the upper end of the rift without changing world.

Am I correct in thinking that the ritual will function regardless of whether or not entities in the area respond to your invitation to join the chant

Yes, but I believe that the Creator will hear me nonetheless.

merely part of the verbal component of the ritual rather than any attempt to gain bonuses by involving multiple necessary participants?

Participants are not necessary but will make the ritual more effective if there are more participants because of the ritual resonance (or unison) effect.

3) Is it the case that your thought projection must successfully function in order for the ritual to succeed

Yes, because I need to project my thoughts to the force field in step 2 of the ritual.

manipulate space such that the two worlds connected by said gate have no physical contact with each other?

That could be said as one of its effect. A material thing without spirit passing through the rift would not be affected. Living beings with spirit would probably notice something if their are intuitive enough but will not pass through the rift because their spirit is attached to the material plane. A spirit could pass through that rift. Any material thing that is turned into spirit form (pseudo-spirit form) could pass the rift. This pseudo-spirit form however will experience world duality when entering the rift. If this pseudo-spirit form changes back to material form before entering the rift completely, they will go back to the world that they came from.

your motion and the needle's motion are, at this point, completely independent, does the needle also need to travel in a spiral around the force field / rift

Yes, the needle will also need to travel with me in unison.

How long do you expect this ritual to take?

Duration estimation of the ritual:
Start of ritual including thought projection and asking for participation: 2 minutes
Spiral the force field and rift: 8 minutes
Chant at the end: 2 minutes
Contraction of force field to seal material plane rift: 2 minutes
Total time: 14 minutes

Is it your intention that the effects will be permanent or temporary

It will be permanent in a way someone sew a cloth together. So, unless the reality or cloth is rip apart again, it will stay that way.

Oo-hii has expressed an intent to be on the other side of the rift. Is it really your plan to close off physical access to the rift before he is able to cross over?

I did say that I will make a tunnel (which is a spiritual one) and said it will take some time to return if he chooses the tunnel option (which is until the end of the ritual plus some time to develop a new skill). Oo-hii knows that I could turn into spiritual form so it is reasonable to think I could bring him home (or back to this world) by turning him into pseudo-spirit form. If he asks about it then I will explain my plan to him.

*****

depending on how I end up treating your Perceive Density

If Morach's Perceive Density is active, he could tag mind via Read Minds normally instead of using "Tag mind of located hidden subject P3@9 enables the telepathic tagging of the mind of an unfamiliar creature whose position is known but who cannot be viewed because of intervening obstacles".

Would you have any objection to that?

Please tell me the reason why you choose to rule either way so I could help you to decide. If it is because Out-of-Sight, then Perceive Density makes it in plain sight.

New, big questions:

I) The spell closes the rift to material things. Does it do this by targeting the rift directly (that is, targeting the effect of the psionic accident), altering its properties? Or does it seal off material access to the rift by manipulating space/reality around it, leaving the rift itself essentially unchanged? I'm assuming it's the latter, based on your statement that the spell will "curve the material plane to close the rift," but if the spell is actually manipulating the rift itself, that's a fundamentally different matter.

II) You say you want to "leave a spiritual rift open but close the material plane rift." You go on to say that "any material thing that is turned into spirit form (pseudo-spirit form) could pass the rift." This leads me to believe that we may have different ideas about what spirit form actually is.

My impression was that your Spirit Form skill works by separating your spirit from your body without killing you. Thus, when you are "in spirit form," what this really means is that that aspect of your existence which distinguishes you from unthinking, unfeeling, non-free-willed objects is operating independently of your physical aspect.

You want the spell's end result to be a portal which allows that "spirit" aspect to pass into another world while leaving the physical aspect behind. I understand that part. What I do not understand is how you intend to pass a needle though such a portal without first creating a spirit for that needle. You mention psuedo-spirit form. I do not know what this is, but I can't think of anything it could be that would allow the needle to pass through the portal without being a "living" entity. (I'm not saying you couldn't create a spirit for the needle, mind. I'm just fairly certain that's not what you had in mind.)

Smaller, follow-up questions:

Actually it could only be performed when I am spiritually present because only the spiritual me can confirm that a spiritual rift is still present after the ritual is finished.

I don't particularly care if you can confirm whether or not it worked. I'm interested in whether or not it would be possible for it to work if your spirit were not separate from you body when you performed the spell. That is, does the magic require that you be in spirit form, such that if (in an emergency, for example) you had to attempt the spell while not in spirit form the attempt would be doomed to fail?

Participants are not necessary but will make the ritual more effective if there are more participants because of the ritual resonance (or unison) effect.

If this bonus is built in to your spell (and not, for instance, the result of the "participants" using special skills of their own to bonus your effort), then that will mean your spell is penalized if there are no participants. Are you okay with that?

_____
Apologies for the delay.

Regarding the Out-of-Sight TK, it seems like you do have an objection. So, you would prefer that you learned the simpler TK skill which requires a targeting sense, and that your Perceive Density is treated as a vision-equivalent sense, and that you were penalized -10 on the TK for using a clairsentience-equivalent to circumvent the line-of-sight requirement?

The alternative is that Perceive Density allowed you to gain the rough idea of position necessary for Out-of-Sight TK, which you may use without penalty to move objects whose position is known to you but of which you receive no direct sensory input.

Does it do this by targeting the rift directly (that is, targeting the effect of the psionic accident), altering its properties? Or does it seal off material access to the rift by manipulating space/reality around it, leaving the rift itself essentially unchanged?

Probably a little bit of both considering the space/reality of the rift are extended like a bubble to go around the other side so that the space will look seamless. That is one of the coded meaning of "unison surreality". The force field will act as a temporary guide for the rift which could be analogize to a spirit possession of material plane then manipulating the material plane of rift (which is why a spirit rift is left behind afterwards). Space/reality around it would probably look the same because the extension is portal-like which can only be perceived if you have a higher dimensional perception.

What I do not understand is how you intend to pass a needle though such a portal without first creating a spirit for that needle.

The needle should not pass the portal if the skill works because the needle is in material form. If I wanted to pass it through the portal I will have to change it into non-corporeal form (or pseudo-spirit form) first.
That is why I use the term pseudo-spirit because a material thing that is turned into non-corporeal form is only mimicking a spirit but not actually a spirit.

That is, does the magic require that you be in spirit form, such that if (in an emergency, for example) you had to attempt the spell while not in spirit form the attempt would be doomed to fail?

Yes, considering the skill would need the unison of material and spiritual which is the needle and me.

If this bonus is built in to your spell (and not, for instance, the result of the "participants" using special skills of their own to bonus your effort), then that will mean your spell is penalized if there are no participants. Are you okay with that?

Yes, the skill would be bonus (more) if the participants are from both sides of the portal (such as Oo-hii that came from the other world) because it would meant the participants understand about the condition of the other world which would make the resonance of the skill much better.

*****

it seems like you do have an objection

I do not mind either way as long as I know the reason why you choose what you choose.

Perceive Density is treated as a vision-equivalent sense

If it is treated as vision-equivalent sense then why does the skill treated as clairsentience-equivalent skill too?
That part confuses me because Perceive Density does not have the ability to see remote object like clairvoyant unless a new skill is created to include it.
The above discussion reminds me of the status of Pluto as a planet when people found Eris.

Probably a little bit of both considering the space/reality of the rift are extended like a bubble to go around the other side so that the space will look seamless. That is one of the coded meaning of "unison surreality". The force field will act as a temporary guide for the rift which could be analogize to a spirit possession of material plane then manipulating the material plane of rift (which is why a spirit rift is left behind afterwards). Space/reality around it would probably look the same because the extension is portal-like which can only be perceived if you have a higher dimensional perception.

I do not understand this. Each time I think I have it, I realize I'm just guessing.

That is why I use the term pseudo-spirit because a material thing that is turned into non-corporeal form is only mimicking a spirit but not actually a spirit.

I'm not certain that a non-corporeal object would have all of the relevant properties of a spirit in this case. Wouldn't a non-corporeal object be a material thing with no physical presence, rather than a spiritual thing? I'm not sure why a non-corporeal needle would have the ability to pass through a spiritual portal. Perhaps I misunderstand your intentions regarding the portal; perhaps it has something to do with my utter lack of comprehension of the paragraph I quoted first.

Yes, considering the skill would need the unison of material and spiritual which is the needle and me.

Noted.

I think I know everything I need to know about this ritual except for what it actually does (see above).

_____

If it is treated as vision-equivalent sense then why does the skill treated as clairsentience-equivalent skill too?

The requirement is actual eyesight, so any skill which is used in place of sight to target the object incurs the penalty. Not every skill which detects an object is capable of being used in place of sight to target the object, however. Thus, the skill is vision-equivalent in that it is a targeting sense (a label I'm borrowing from the Champions role-playing game, meaning a sense which provides accurate and precise information regarding location sufficient for targeting in combat), but clairvoyant-equivalent in that it is being used to circumvent the "line of sight" requirement for telekinesis.

The question is whether or not we're treating Perceive Density as a targeting sense. If is not a targeting sense, then you must have learned Out-of-Sight TK. If it is a targeting sense, then you might have learned either Simple or Out-of-Sight (but most probably Simple), and I'd consider letting you pick which one you learned.

I do not understand this. Each time I think I have it, I realize I'm just guessing.

Then just guess about how it works (because that could be fun). You could simplify it to a ritual that you can understand. If it have different effects than I intended, we will discuss about it then as long you understand the intended effects of the ritual as sealing the rift materially but leaving a spiritual tunnel open.

Wouldn't a non-corporeal object be a material thing with no physical presence, rather than a spiritual thing?

Yes, that is right which is why "pseudo-spirit form" actually is the better term for it. Pseudo-spirit form mimics spirit form enough to let you pass through the spiritual rift.

I think I know everything I need to know about this ritual except for what it actually does (see above).

As long it have the intended effects I do not mind which method you choose. I would leave that to your judgment.

*****

clairvoyant-equivalent in that it is being used to circumvent the "line of sight" requirement for telekinesis.

Can you tell me more about the definition of "line of sight"?
Does it include an object that is seen through a glass or reflected by a mirror?
How about an object seen through a scope?

If it is a targeting sense, then you might have learned either Simple or Out-of-Sight (but most probably Simple), and I'd consider letting you pick which one you learned.

I think my character targets the needle because he can see it. It would be weird to move the needle without targeting it if my character could see it.

While Scott is regrouping, I'm going to attempt to address some of these points.

• Maxx quoting Scott:
  

  Wouldn't a non-corporeal object be a material thing with no physical presence, rather than a spiritual thing?

  Yes, that is right which is why "pseudo-spirit form" actually is the better term for it. Pseudo-spirit form mimics spirit form enough to let you pass through the spiritual rift.

  There are several forms of non-corporeality/non-physicality of which "spirit form" is only one. An "ethereal form" could exist which is something like a "gaseous form" but that it is not made of matter and not subject to matter or energy in the physical realm, for example. The particular form of non-physicality that you've described for yourself involves separating the spirit from the body (as opposed to converting the body into a spiritual, ethereal, or non-physical form).

  Spirits are fundamentally supernatural, essentially so.

  I don't know more about the rift this botch created than you do, but I do know that a gate that allows spiritual but not physical objects to pass through it almost certainly does so by traveling through the border supernatural, and its rules would define "spirit" rather strictly. An ethereal object might have to count as a material object in that definition, and thus would not be able to pass through.

  But I take it that you are attempting to remove from the needle the property of "material substance", making it an immaterial object. That's certainly possible. It would, however, probably then require that you develop a form of telekinesis that is effective against non-material objects so you can manipulate it. It also remains possible that an "immaterial object" is different enough from a "spirit" that it could not pass through the same restrictive portal--remember, your spirit might be an immaterial object, but it is a specific type, a supernatural object existing in a material world.

• Maxx:
  

  Can you tell me more about the definition of "line of sight"?
  Does it include an object that is seen through a glass or reflected by a mirror?
  How about an object seen through a scope?

  The point of "line of sight" is that you are using your normal vision to fix the position of the target object. I would say a simple test would be whether the "obstacle" involved alters your perception in a way that would impact hand/eye. For example, If you are holding a pen and can see your hand, you can trace the lines on a paper. If you are viewing your hand through a sheet of glass that does not distort the view, that will not alter your ability to trace the image. If, however, the glass warps the scene, or mirrors it, you take a penalty.

  A good example would be a rifle (slug thrower) with a laser sight. Your vision is like the laser, which touches the targeted object giving you vector and distance, and then when you pull the trigger the slug hits the target. Anything that removes your natural sense of distance and direction from the equation is like shutting off the laser.

I hope this helps.

--M. J. Young

I do know that a gate that allows spiritual but not physical objects to pass through it almost certainly does so by traveling through the border supernatural, and its rules would define "spirit" rather strictly.

Considering that the ritual is cast by Morach, the definition of "spirit" would be according to him right?
His definition of "spirit" would allow things with certain properties to past through which would mean that the gate would be a bit different from the gate that travels through the border supernatural. It would be closer to making a bypass tunnel of the material world that exists in hyperspace and leaving a spiritual tunnel behind which could be accessed by spirit or other immaterial things (that are guided by spirit).

But I take it that you are attempting to remove from the needle the property of "material substance", making it an immaterial object.
It would, however, probably then require that you develop a form of telekinesis that is effective against non-material objects so you can manipulate it. It also remains possible that an "immaterial object" is different enough from a "spirit" that it could not pass through the same restrictive portal

All of the above problems could be solved if I extend my spirit to include the immaterial objects as part of my spirit just like an additional limb. I also said "leave the traces spiritually" and said that I was going to manipulate material properties of the rift so immaterial object could pass it if the immaterial object have traces of spiritual form.

If you are viewing your hand through a sheet of glass that does not distort the view, that will not alter your ability to trace the image. If, however, the glass warps the scene, or mirrors it, you take a penalty.

I think Perceive Density can view the needle through obstacles like viewing things through a sheet of glass that does not distort the view. If that is the case, should the user of Perceive Density take a penalty for it?

I hope this helps.

Yes, thank you very much.

Thank you, MJ.

If he asks about it then I will explain my plan to him.

Oo-hii does not ask questions, but watches you and the needle warily from his position on the home tree. When you figure out the trick of projecting your thoughts without contacting a specific mind, you begin your ritual; Oo-hii does not join in, but neither does he interrupt.

Your movement of the neelde is somewhat clumsy, but you manage the required motions. At the end, you feel that you are tapping in to supernatural forces - becoming a conduit for energies from outside of normal reality. On cue, the force sphere surrounding the rift begins to twist and contract.

::You're getting rid of the shield now, yes? We can go through soon?::

The rift is not responding how it should. It is bending and warping, as you wanted, but it seems to be working against the force field, not with it, almost like it's fighting back -

- and all at once there is a flash of pinkish light and a wave of force and heat passes painlessly through you. Space seems to ripple around you with the force of the explosion, and you hear Oo-hii cry out in surprise and pain.

The rift still stands. The force shield is gone.

The forest still stands, but the explosion has ripped through underbrush and knocked down small trees for as far as your incorporeal eye can see. Everything is at least scorched or singed, and anything particularly dry and flammable - for example, the leaf litter on the forest floor, in many places - has caught fire.

Your mother's thoughts intrude, frantic:

::Morach!! Baby, can you hear me? Are you alright?::

Oo-hii is battered, smoking, and furious.

_____
Subjectively, does your character experience the density perception as something more akin to eyesight or more akin to a priori knowledge?

On to the ritual:

My guess is that this is not strictly operating on the rift itself, but rather it seeks to manipulate reality around the rift such that it interacts differently with its surroundings. As such, the spell is a M15@8 Alter Space, and Maxx starts off with a -81 penalty for his mere M7@7 character bias. Assume maximum world bias (I'll consider the issue if the roll is within fifteen percent of a break point) for +15, and unless his An-Mag is level 2 (is it?), his BRA is his 1@10 Intuition for +20; no teacher, no instructor, no example. That leaves -46 before ritual sit-mods.

Oddly, he has all three categories of component (verbal, somatic, material), despite his unusual circumstances. I'm allowing thought projection to substitute for spoken words at no penalty (though a skill roll will be required at amateur Thought Projection SALs; this time it's free because skill learning success is guaranteed, congratulations on your 1@1 SAL for the 33 rolled, remind me to add that to your sheet, Maxx); I'm ignoring the adjustments for "sound necessary" and "forceful/sung", but granting +5 for appropriate words.

Somatically, he really on has one body part: his position. It is involved, and no other part may be substituted, which is baseline. I will not be convinced to award the bonus for "fully body involvement" in this case. However, I'm willing to grant +10 for the requirement that the caster's spirit must be separated from his body for the casting.

Materially, he needs a force field and a metal needle. The metal needle is a common manufactured object of a specified but general material, for +3. The force field is somewhat harder to come by, so I'll give a value of six, doubled because the shield is consumed, for a total of +12 for the shield.

Baseline time factor is nine minutes. The ritual is twelve (the last two minutes are just the magic taking effect, requiring no involvement from the caster), which is 33% of a doubling for +3. Baseline duration is RS minutes, but permanent Alter Space effects are allowed at only -25.

Ritual factors thus total -2 (+5 verbal, +10 miscellaneous, +15 material, +3 TF, -25 duration), for a total modified skill learning success chance of -48 if the ritual is arcane. I'm assuming it is, so that's an 84% chance to fail and a 14% chance to botch. Let's see the roll:

89.

Just not your day, is it?

Well, it's an alter reality spell that directly manipulates space, so
most bets are off. As a bonus, the intended effect was meant to take couple of minutes to manifest, so might I have an excuse to draw out whatever catastrophe is lucky enough to be picked from the following table:

1) Tear rift wider (way wider)
2) Open new gate
3) Shift universe into the border supernatural
4) Magical anomaly
5) Implosion
6) Explosion
7) Summon malignant entity
8) All living entities in locality swap universes
9) Locality swap (closes rift)
10) Trans-universe spirit exchange program (does not)
11) Extract dual locality into pocket dimension
12) Closure apparently unsuccessful (force shield consumed)

And the roll is: 6, Explosion. Ah, well. I was hoping for something more closely related to the nature of the mishap, but explosions are nice too, I guess.

The dual GE roll for damage/area is fun though: 13 for damage (Lethal + Annoying, which is "barely good enough") and 19 for area of effect (primary blast radius of 1 Mile, "not thwarting, but generally unfavorable"). Also, it occurs to me that we don't know for certain how close Maxx's parents (and body) are, so we'll need a GE for that, too: 18, "not favorable". It's been nearly half an hour, so they'll have gone some distance away, but not, I think, so far as a mile; I'd want at least Barely Good Enough for that. After all, there is no clear and present threat from their perspective, only an unusual paranormal occurance and odd behavior from their child. They will be out of sight of rift, probably near water, but within the primary blast radius.

Damage: 45 lethal, 76 annoying rider, that's 9 intensities of kinetic damage + 1 intensity heat and flame, total ten intensities. Maxx's damage value is currently 1@5, so he'll survive, and his parents will also. They get simple TV checks to reduce the damage, and I'll let Lelach's cover Maxx as well: Morani 14, Lelach 22. That'll succeed for Morani due to a high Agility, but even if I granted Lelach a 1@10 Intuition, she'd need a 2@7 Agility to achieve a TV of 2@3, so that's failure for her and the child she carries. Morani takes Dangerous + (Annoying -10), for (5+1=) six intensities, but Lelach and Morach each take the full ten. All the principal players live, but the flora and fauna are in a bad way. (Six intensities out to two miles, four out to three, none after that. Six miles diamater meaningfully impacted.)

Oh, forgot Oo-hii: 31 is certainly above his target value, so he takes full damage, which he certainly survives.

Second post (crossed with Maxx):

Considering that the ritual is cast by Morach, the definition of "spirit" would be according to him right?

No. Spirit is already defined. All you can decide is whether or not you're doing magic that treats spirits differently, and/or whether the magic makes reference to some other distinction.

It would be closer to making a bypass tunnel of the material world that exists in hyperspace and leaving a spiritual tunnel behind which could be accessed by spirit or other immaterial things (that are guided by spirit)

Well, why didn't you say so? That sounds like you're opening a new portal to replace the one you're closing, which gives you a little more control over how that portal works (as opposed to part-way closing an existing portal, as I interpreted the spell). Of course, it also means you're incorporating a second skill listing into the ritual, which would involve negative sit-mods. Everything in the above post stands.

I think Perceive Density can view the needle through obstacles like viewing things through a sheet of glass that does not distort the view. If that is the case, should the user of Perceive Density take a penalty for it?

Yes, of course. You're not looking at the object, you're noticing an object-shaped volume of density suggestive of an object. My only question was whether this was more like a sixth sense (thus treated like clairvoyance, -10 to simple TK) or more like a detection (thus requiring P4@3 Out of Sight to target the object). You seem to think of it like vision, so we'll go with the former.

Does my parents or anyone else participate in the ritual?

I wonder if the other side of the portal exploded too so I will take a peek to the other side of the portal.
The needle would probably be stuck to the ground because it is situated below the force field when the explosion happened.

Morach!! Baby, can you hear me? Are you alright?

"Yes, I am alright."

You're getting rid of the shield now, yes? We can go through soon?
Oo-hii is battered, smoking, and furious.

"Sorry, that does not exactly behave like I intended. You should check your nest on the other side to see if everything is intact."

This sounds like a good opportunity to learn how to control space/time.
First, I will have to stay in my spiritual form longer.
I will concentrate for a minute then try to make the spirit form travel independently as long as the body life function is preserved.

I will then concentrate for 8 minutes then try to stop material space/time.

*****

Subjectively, does your character experience the density perception as something more akin to eyesight or more akin to a priori knowledge?

I think it is more akin to eyesight as I specified it as so.

for a total modified skill learning success chance of -48 if the ritual is arcane. I'm assuming it is, so that's an 84% chance to fail and a 14% chance to botch.

Do you mean 86% chance to fail and a 14% chance to botch?
I just wanted to tell you that the ritual is actually a unison prayer which could be considered alliance magic considering the act of healing wound and I have "1@5 Religion, undisclosed alliance faith M1@0".

Ritual factors thus total -2 (+5 verbal, +10 miscellaneous, +15 material, +3 TF, -25 duration),

Ritual factor = 5+10+15+3-25 = 8
Modified skill learning success before religion bonus = -46+8 = -38
If holy alliance = -38+10+8(half religion score)= -20
That would make the skill have 12% chance of botch and 88% chance of failure which is still a botch. I am still happy though because I can see how it is calculated. I know that permanency would make it more likely to botch but I did not know by how much. Did you see the effect of how 1 participant could change the flow of events?

That sounds like you're opening a new portal to replace the one you're closing, which gives you a little more control over how that portal works (as opposed to part-way closing an existing portal, as I interpreted the spell). Of course, it also means you're incorporating a second skill listing into the ritual, which would involve negative sit-mods.

What second skill?
That only means that I connect things materially together but leaving the spiritual/immaterial part intact which resembles locality swap which only effects material things. I also said that any other methods that would achieve the same intended effects would qualify as the result. If that counts as opening a new portal then what are the negative sit-mods?

They will be out of sight of rift, probably near water, but within the primary blast radius.

Thanks to the botch I know their location now although Morach does not.

Six miles diamater meaningfully impacted.

Wow! A destructive force indeed.

It's too late at night for a full post, but I can hit a few points.

Did you see the effect of how 1 participant could change the flow of events?

Actually, I thought I made a merciful choice here. I saw two ways I could approach your invitation for others to participate:

1) Additional participants, if they assist, assist under their own power - that is, they use skills of their own to boost your chance of success. Thus, you don't need them, but they could help if they succeed at their own skills checks. (Bonus Skill Checks is M1@4 - very simple magic, in bias terms.)

2) Additional participants are expected, and the magic is more difficult to perform without them. They don't need to make skill checks to assist because their participation at your behest is part of your ritual, but you are relying on them joining in and so suffer a penalty if fewer than expected participate.

Given that I thought it highly unlikely that any creature in range of your broadcast thought projection even had the ability to speak (or project thought), I thought it at least as unlikely that you would garner even a single participant. It would require a general effects roll to determine if anyone or anything on the other side of the portal was both (a) a valid potential participant and (b) decided to participate. Given my view of the situation, it would take a strongly positive roll to mean you got your participants, and making that roll, of course, would open you up to the possibility of negative results.

Even with that in mind, the sit-mod would likely be something like -5, +2 per additional participant, or -10, +3 per additional participant, or something along those lines. A threshold would need to be reached before the bonus for the assistance began to outweigh the penalty for not actually needing the assistance.

So as I said, I thought it more generous to assume (1). Perhaps I ought to have rolled a GE for if anything on the other side of the portal heard you, wanted to help, and was willing to invent a M1@4 Bonus Magic Skill Check spell based on joining in with another caster's chant. Perhaps I ought to have, or perhaps I know something you don't.

I admit that I never considered whether your parents would join in or not. That is because I knew they were not in the immediate area, I understood you to be projecting thought to the immediate area only, and I didn't think you were also uttering the incantation across your private telepathic links with your parents. I was under the impression they never even knew you were casting.

What kind of range were you expecting on your broadcast thought projection? Perhaps we ought to have explored that in more depth. I wasn't thinking anything more than a 30 meter radius.

Ritual factor = 5+10+15+3-25 = 8

Yeah, I added in the +10 for spirit form after the fact and neglected to update the math to reflect it. However:

I just wanted to tell you that the ritual is actually a unison prayer which could be considered alliance magic considering the act of healing wound and I have "1@5 Religion, undisclosed alliance faith M1@0".

Perhaps I should have asked whether this were holy or arcane, but I saw nothing in this spell to indicate that you were praying to God to close the rift for you. I'm not saying all holy magic has to include a direct appeal to a deity, but ultimately the distinction is this: with arcane magic, you manipulate the magic yourself. With holy magic, you petition some other entity to manipulate it on your behalf. Under that definition, do you still think was alliance holy magic you were attempting?

(Also, if you try to do holy magic without disclosing the religion, you will irritate me. I'm not saying I won't let you, necessarily - hasn't happened, so I don't have to decide yet - but it would bother me. It's hard for me to run the game if I don't know what going on.)

I will then concentrate for 8 minutes then try to stop material space/time.

I'm about to fall unconscious, but I thought I'd warn you that I'll want to know more about this. I'm not even 100% sure it's psionic, much less willing to hazard a guess as to minor details like area of effect, "duration," whether you intend to affect both sides of the rift or just one, etc. ...

Additional participants are expected, and the magic is more difficult to perform without them. They don't need to make skill checks to assist because their participation at your behest is part of your ritual, but you are relying on them joining in and so suffer a penalty if fewer than expected participate.

I did expect some to join in so I think the above is more likely. If I expect at least one being to join then what would be the penalty and bonus then?

I didn't think you were also uttering the incantation across your private telepathic links with your parents. I was under the impression they never even knew you were casting.

In step (1) of the ritual, I did say that I will:

ask anyone that have telepathy connection with me to chant with me in their own language if they wanted to.

That proves that Morach intent to tell everyone that have telepathy connection with him about the ritual.

What kind of range were you expecting on your broadcast thought projection?

Probably RS multiplied by my current adult size.

Under that definition, do you still think was alliance holy magic you were attempting?

Yes, below is the response that shows that.

Previously you wrote:
Am I correct in thinking that the ritual will function regardless of whether or not entities in the area respond to your invitation to join the chant
And I replied:
Yes, but I believe that the Creator will hear me nonetheless.

I also said that:

As long it have the intended effects I do not mind which method you choose. I would leave that to your judgment.

That shows that I do not intent to manipulate it myself.

if you try to do holy magic without disclosing the religion, you will irritate me.

I did tell about my religion previously but I just did not tell what is the name of the religion. The below is my answer when asked about it.

Well, I study various religion and belief system.
It is sufficient to say I believe in a power that governs all reality and simulation where each world are some sort of frequency.
This collective frequency is like the mind of God or a part of it.

If you want me to name it then "Panentheism" would probably be best to describe it.

area of effect, "duration," whether you intend to affect both sides of the rift or just one

If I think relatively that the spirit have infinity speed then the area of effect would be self relative to all. The "duration" would be the apparent duration of the skill that would be about RS minutes. If it is cast to self relative to all then both sides of the rift should be affected when viewed from the user.

I also said that:

As long it have the intended effects I do not mind which method you choose. I would leave that to your judgment.

That shows that I do not intent to manipulate it myself.

This is perhaps the best example yet of how much we're failing to communicate. I understood the sentences you quoted to mean, "Scott, please stop dragging out this mechanical discussion. Just pick something that could accomplish my objectives and roll for it."

So I did.

In the process, I made several swift decisions in an effort to get the game moving again, and I was not prepared for an Inquisition afterward. Had I known we would still be discussing it now, I would have taken far more time discussing it before I rolled the dice.

I have to go to work. When I get back, I'll probably make a separate thread for this discussion so we can continue the game in this one. [Edit: unless you'd like to start it yourself, of course, in my absence.]

This is perhaps the best example yet of how much we're failing to communicate.

Sorry about that. I probably should have made my point clearer.

Had I known we would still be discussing it now, I would have taken far more time discussing it before I rolled the dice.

Well, I did not mind about it because to me it is still a botch. The discussion is done just in case I wanted to do the same thing in the future.

When I get back, I'll probably make a separate thread for this discussion so we can continue the game in this one.

That will be up to you. I am satisfied with your ruling. If you want to discuss it in another thread to ask for clarification just in case I would repeat the skill again then be my guest.

I will concentrate for a minute then try to make the spirit form travel independently as long as the body life function is preserved.

I assume that this means "until death"; if you mean something else by this, tell me now. I can allow this at baseline (no bonus or penalty) on the following conditions: (1) a second successful skill check must be made to reunite your spirit with your body, and (2) your spirit must return to your body's location in order to do so. Is this acceptable? and, have I correctly understood your intent?

If I think relatively that the spirit have infinity speed then the area of effect would be self relative to all. The "duration" would be the apparent duration of the skill that would be about RS minutes. If it is cast to self relative to all then both sides of the rift should be affected when viewed from the user.

This sounds like you're not actually stopping time, but are instead accelerating your own speed to an incredible degree. Which is it? And, is this intended to be psionic, arcane magic, or holy magic?

"Yes, I am alright."

Your father's thoughts come across the link, seeming a little strained.
::Son, I need you to wake up now. You're upsetting your mother.::

____
Again, holding off on running the actions until I know what they are.

I wonder if the other side of the portal exploded too so I will take a peek to the other side of the portal.

What happen to the other side of the portal?

Son, I need you to wake up now. You're upsetting your mother.

"I am sorry but I cannot wake up right now because I am in deep sleep state. I probably will wake up after a quarter day passes by. Please tell mom not to worry."
If I am not mistaken, the telepathy connection to Morach's parents would probably be ending any minute soon.

"Sorry, that does not exactly behave like I intended. You should check your nest on the other side to see if everything is intact."

Does Oo-hii reply to my thoughts?
If he does not reply then I will say, "Are you alright? Do you want me to tend to your wound or something? Please wait as long as the ritual time while I find a way to help you."

I will then resume my next actions.

*****

I assume that this means "until death"

Yes, that is right.

(1) a second successful skill check must be made to reunite your spirit with your body

I agree with this condition.

(2) your spirit must return to your body's location in order to do so.

This condition however is a little weird considering Morach does not know his current body location unless he deactivates the spirit form (or tries to use his other skills to search for his body). So I think the next best thing would be to include a remote presence skill which would penalize the learning of this skill if it is done remotely. I just hope that the concentration period bonus is high enough to cancel out the penalty of doing it from afar.

This sounds like you're not actually stopping time, but are instead accelerating your own speed to an incredible degree. Which is it?

That depends on how a person perceive space/time. Relative to Morach's perception, the space/time actually stops. The material world would probably be limited to certain speed (such as speed of light) but in spirit form, a being could achieve much greater speed. So I guess it would be the latter if viewed from the environment perspective.

And, is this intended to be psionic, arcane magic, or holy magic?

I intend it to be psionic.

If I expect at least one being to join then what would be the penalty and bonus then?

This question should be thought about (but preferably not answered until it matters) for reasons that will be obvious in the future. I wonder if the skill will be penalized if only one person is expected to participate in it. I also wonder what the bonus would be for additional participants.

Sorry, I was falling unconscious while posting so I only responded to half of your post; I figured half a response was better than none. I started off with mechanical roadblocks and then started tackling actions in what I perceived as chronological order until I ran out of steam. Yes, you check the other side of the portal, and yes, Oo-hii responds; I just didn't get to that last night. Post coming soon.

"Sorry, that does not exactly behave like I intended. You should check your nest on the other side to see if everything is intact."

::Save your taunts for when I find you, liar! Perhaps they will comfort you as I wet my throat with your blood!::

He takes off into the forest canopy, moving erratically, but headed away and vaguely northward.

I wonder if the other side of the portal exploded too so I will take a peek to the other side of the portal.

It is immediately obvious that the explosion hit here, too, but the plant life seems to be in better condition overall. Nothing is on fire; things are steaming, not smoking. The smell of ozone has intensified ten-fold, and small mammals, birds, and insects litter the forest floor, looking as though they've fallen from the trees. The insects you can see have been crisped. You can hear what sounds like something massive moving in the underbrush some distance away, but you don't see where it's coming from. A purple mist that wasn't there before hangs over one nearby bush.

"I am sorry but I cannot wake up right now because I am in deep sleep state. I probably will wake up after a quarter day passes by. Please tell mom not to worry."

You mother begins to plead with you to awaken, but you hear no reply from your father.

___

(2) your spirit must return to your body's location in order to do so.

Just to be clear, I meant you would need to find your body to end the effect. With the semi-permanent effect, you don't need to worry about maintaining your spirit form. Because it's semi-permanent, though, you can't just say, "I'm done" and pop back to your body; the semi-permanent spirit form needs to be actively undone, and your body's location needs to at least be known for that process to be possible.

If you'd like to initiate the semi-permanent spirit form while away from your body, though, I see no reason to disallow that or to penalize it. Go right ahead.

Does that clear things up, or did you already know that and I misunderstood your objection?

That depends on how a person perceive space/time.

No, it depends on what you're targeting. Are you psionically manipulating the universe such that time slows/stops materially, or are you psionically manipulating yourself such that, from your subjective point of view, time appears to have slowed or stopped? These are very different skills with different bias listings, and the choice has other consequences beyond that. It is not a matter of perspective.

So I guess it would be the latter if viewed from the environment perspective.

Does this mean the target is yourself, not the universe?

If I am not mistaken, the telepathy connection to Morach's parents would probably be ending any minute soon.

You are mistaken. You have a good twenty minutes left, not that you know it.

Save your taunts for when I find you, liar

Cannot blame Oo-hii for calling me a liar. Oh well, what is done is done.
I wonder if "was" is more appropriate for that sentence but I think Morach do not have time to think about that.

Perhaps they will comfort you as I wet my throat with your blood!

"They?", I asked but not expecting any answer.

He takes off into the forest canopy, moving erratically, but headed away and vaguely northward.

Which way is that?
If the rift is in between my spirit and the winter tree position (or what is left of it), then which way does Oo-hii moves to?

You can hear what sounds like something massive moving in the underbrush some distance away, but you don't see where it's coming from. A purple mist that wasn't there before hangs over one nearby bush.

Interesting. It looks like some dangerous things are coming.

You mother begins to plead with you to awaken

I will advise my father to take my mother away from the explosion source.

After that, I will resume with my next actions.

*****

Just to be clear, I meant you would need to find your body to end the effect.

That clears it up. I misunderstood it earlier. If that is the case then I agree.

are you psionically manipulating yourself such that, from your subjective point of view, time appears to have slowed or stopped?

Yes. For this skill, time appears to have stopped.

Does this mean the target is yourself, not the universe?

Yes because I did not think I have the power to target the universe psionically yet although that feat would be possible using alliance magic.

You are mistaken. You have a good twenty minutes left, not that you know it.

The below is the roll for it.

Even without knowing if this is a skill learning attempt or skill performance, a 29 succeeds (and if it's two consecutive skill performances, a 44 would work for the second).

That would mean that you take 44 as the RS. Subtracting the 14 minutes of ritual time and 10 minutes of perceive density and force field (including the 2 minutes failure) from 44 minutes would equal to 20 minutes. I did not know how long the spirit ejection, mind meld botch, telepathy, suggestion, travel, detect materials and others would take but I think they would probably be negligible if I really have 20 minutes left.

I wonder if "was" is more appropriate for that sentence

No, it's "is." At the present time, the subject under discussion is in a state of completion: it is done, and it remains so.

You are correct that I was mistaken concerning the telepathy duration; I was looking at the 51 you rolled for Oo-hii. However, that forty-four I rolled was a hypothetical, to cover all my bases until we figured out what you had done. It later turned out that you were learning a single skill (not attempting a known skill twice), so the 44 was discarded and the 29 became the only successful roll. You have approximately 0:00 remaining on the telepathy, unless you want to chain it.

"They?", I asked but not expecting any answer.

In this case, the antecedent of "they" is "your taunts"; perhaps [your taunts] will comfort you as I [murder you painfully].

Which way is [north]?

Pick a direction. It doesn't particularly matter, because once he's about fifteen or twenty meters out, he veers right, embarking on what is either a spiral or circular trajectory.

I will advise my father to take my mother away from the explosion source.

You can feel the telepathic connection fading as you send this message. Are you attempting to maintain it, or are you letting it go?

I will concentrate for a minute then try to make the spirit form travel independently as long as the body life function is preserved.

I will then concentrate for 8 minutes then try to stop material space/time.

You achieve the more permanent severance of your spirit from your body.
_____

60 rolled means Maxx learns Controlled Out-of-Body P5@10 with a 1@2 SAL. Both his telepathy and his spirit form expire basically now, so this is good timing.

I need to poll opinions on this time stop thing. I started a thread here.

Thanks for the language tips.

In this case, the antecedent of "they" is "your taunts"; perhaps [your taunts] will comfort you as I [murder you painfully].

I guess Morach and Oo-hii seems to have communication problems too.

You can feel the telepathic connection fading as you send this message. Are you attempting to maintain it, or are you letting it go?

I will say goodbye to both my parents before the connection fades. I will then let go of the connection to concentrate on my next action.

You achieve the more permanent severance of your spirit from your body.

According to my calculation the spirit form should expire a minute after mass telepathy.
Did I feel anything change during this more permanent severance or did I just feel that the skill did not fade anymore?

*****

I need to poll opinions on this time stop thing.

Interesting, is it not?

Did I feel anything change during this more permanent severance or did I just feel that the skill did not fade anymore?

Yes, you did. Mostly, it feels like one less thing you have to keep your mind on; a distraction has been removed.

I will then concentrate for 8 minutes then try to stop material space/time.

Something large snuffles around the opening of the other side of the rift while you're concentrating, but you mostly ignore it, and it goes away. You are vaugely aware that Oo-hii's path of travel is a wide spiral, not a circle.

When you feel you are finished, you cease to feel the breeze blowing through you; the tiny, lingering fires that litter the forest floor no longer flicker, their flames frozen in place (or perhaps oozing into new positions, almost imperceptibly slowly). You appear to have succeeded.

What now?

____

22 rolled learns the following skill (-27 character bias, +20 BRA, +40 SM, etc.):

1@1 Time Stop (Hyperaccelration) P14@8 requires eight minutes high concentration to initiate, appears to stop time for all but the user by tremendously slowing his temporal experience, allowing him to take actions which do not involve his material aspects at a hyperaccelerated rate, lasts RS subjective minutes, strenuous chaining, +40 SM

Incidentally, his psi bias rises to 14@8.

Mostly, it feels like one less thing you have to keep your mind on; a distraction has been removed.

That makes me wonder if I can return back to my body later. I probably can detect my body using detect materials by detecting my own hair/saliva or locate my family mind but I wonder if I can detect my body using easier methods (or if I happen to stumble on one).

You are vaugely aware that Oo-hii's path of travel is a wide spiral, not a circle.

That is a good way to search someone. I could calculate his detection range if I can see the pattern of the spiral but I guess I am too busy concentrating at that time.

lingering fires that litter the forest floor no longer flicker, their flames frozen in place (or perhaps oozing into new positions, almost imperceptibly slowly).

Did I notice the change of the flames if I only look at it for a while?
I will remember the shape of the frozen flames for future reference.
I will also look for a falling object (or smoke motion) for comparison purposes and if I can find it then I remember this instead of the frozen flames.
If the environment still moves albeit slowly, this probably means that the acceleration still does not achieve light speed. If it achieves light speed, the environment would probably stop. If material things try to accelerate to light speed then probably their time would stop too (if they manage to) so I think only immaterial things could accelerate to light speed or over. The law of physics in Morach's verse could be different which I think would be interesting to experiment.

What now?

I wonder what would happen if I travel faster than light.
Would I travel back in space/time or would I only perceive space act in reverse?
Would I perceive it to move in reverse faster if I increase the speed further?
I think I could see past events of one location if I travel faster than light but I have to see the event further away from the location. This probably would not change the fact that the event have already happened.
To test the above notion, I will get away from the rift to see if I can see the past events of the rift from the perspective of light that came from it a fractions of second ago especially the shape of the frozen flames. After that I will go back to the rift to compare the shape of the frozen flames when view at close before (first viewing), when view at a distance, and when view at close after (second viewing). If I see a falling object (or smoke motion) near the rift then I will compare that instead.
I will use about a minute (of apparent time) for the above purposes.

If I found that the event would not change after I go away and back, I will go to the other side of the rift and check things out.
I will go the the *bad place* and try to examine whatever substance that might trigger evolution to Oo-hii's brother if it is in a minute distance. If I did not know the direction to the *bad place* then I will look for a place that looks like one from Oo-hii memories.

Did I notice the change of the flames if I only look at it for a while?

No; perhaps you were imagining it.

To test the above notion . . .
I will use about a minute (of apparent time) for the above purposes.

If there is any difference in the scene from a distance of several meters away, you cannot detect it. There appears to be no danger of inadvertantly looking at the past rather than the present.

You pass through the portal.

One of the dangers of the *bad places*, as you'll recall, is that it can be difficult to tell when you are in one. Further, while you have some vague recollection of the general shape of Oo-hii's territory, you have no idea at all where the rift is located in that territory (if, indeed, it is located in his territory at all, though it seems unlikely that it would not be). If you knew where the rift was, you might be able to figure out an appropriate direction of travel, but you currently lack that knowledge.

You don't have any visual memories that would allow you to identify a *bad place* by sight; in any case, *bad places* can cover quite a bit of ground, so a visual snapshot would be unhelpful in locating one.

One thing you remember that could be helpful is that the flora and fauna in the *bad places* often differs somewhat from what's in Oo-hii's general territory. The changes aren't always obvious, but if (for example) while wandering around you suddenly notice that a particular pink fungus which had been common is suddenly nowhere to be seen, you might have wandered into a *bad place*. This knowledge would be more helpful if you were more familiar with the local wildlife, of course.

Given all of this, do you have a plan for locating a *bad place* other than wandering around and hoping somewhere looks familiar? And, how long are you willing to spend searching before trying something else (if you don't find one, that is)?

_____
Even if every second of real time took one day of apparent time to elapse (that's roughly fifteen apparent minutes per real hundredth-second, slow enough that apparent time passes imperceptibly), light is still moving at an apparent rate of (very roughly) 3,300m/s, or 33m per hundredth-second. Even if perception in spirit form is affected by such material concerns as the speed of light (an open question), and even if the physical laws of this universe are essentially unchanged, that is far beyond Maxx's apparent speed, and he won't get to glimpse the past at the speeds and distances he'll be able to manage over the course of a minute's casual experimentation.

The question of how he will find a *bad place* is more interesting to me. A difficult intellect check for recalling useful memories from the mind meld comes up 14, a success I was not expecting. However, success at this does not entail successful location of a *bad place*; it just means he recalls something helpful. We'll give him something and see what he does with it.

There appears to be no danger of inadvertantly looking at the past rather than the present.

Interesting, that means I am slower than light. Probably I should try a light pulse experiment later to see how fast I really am.

You pass through the portal.

That is the first time I pass through a portal. To commemorate this event, I will spin around the portal to look around this other world and examine the indigenous substance (situated close to the rift) that looks peculiar and I have not seen it anywhere before. I will take one apparent minute doing this.

Given all of this, do you have a plan for locating a *bad place* other than wandering around and hoping somewhere looks familiar?

That would take a lot of time and since I have more pressing matters at hand I will abort the plan to search for *bad place* for now.

I wonder what would happen if a material (or spirit) falls over the edge of rift.
Would that material (or spirit) be cut in half or something?
To test this, I will go to the side of the rift and face its edge. I will concentrate for 4 minutes then try to create a light ball right in front of me.
If I succeed, I will let it move to the edge of the rift and see what happens. If it is not cut in half when the ball is at the center of the rift, I will try to move the light ball to other side of the portal which would theoretically left half of ball on this side and the other half of the ball to the other side although it would be interesting to see what actually would happen.
The light ball is a sphere (with diameter of Morach's palm) that emits light in an outward fashion to conserve energy although you could make it emit light inwardly too if Morach feels that adding this feat makes the skill easier to be done although I doubt expanding more energy would make it easier. It will last RS apparent minutes.

*****

"Walking Speeds" of two to seven miles per hour = 0.89408 m/s to 3.12928 m/s
1 day = 86400 seconds
1 apparent second = 1/86400 real second
Hyper speed = 77248.512 m/s to 270369.792 m/s
Light speed = 299 792 458 m/s or about 300 000 km/s
Apparent light speed = 3470 m/s [viewed from spirit form if spirit can travel faster than light but if the perception is the same as material form then the speed of light would be the same because the perception would be made slower]
Percentage to speed of light (PSL)= 0.026% to 0.09% [approximate value]
PSL*(2^x)=100
2^x=100/PSL
x ln 2 = ln(100/PSL)
x = ln(100/PSL)/ln 2
x = ln(1109)/ln 2 to ln(3881)/ln 2
x = 10.115 to 11.92
Doubling to exceed speed of light from minimum walking speed = 12
Haste that doubles speed eleven times would probably work too if the initial speed is the maximum of "walking speeds".
The above is the calculation just in case that Morach attempt to exceed speed of light.

and examine the indigenous substance (situated close to the rift) that looks peculiar and I have not seen it anywhere before

Saying "the substance" (as opposed to "a substance" or "any substance" or other similar phrase) implies a particular substance which we previously mentioned and which you expect me to recognize as being the substance you're referring to. Is this the case (and if so, what in particular do you refer to - the tree bark, perhaps?), or are you merely looking for unfamilar substances and examining any such substances that you find?

To test this, I will go to the side of the rift and face its edge. I will concentrate for 4 minutes then try to create a light ball right in front of me.

You concentrate, but you can't seem to figure out how to transform your inner power into something with material existence. After four apparent minutes, you have nothing to show for your efforts.

_____
A slight language hiccup and a skill learning roll: 91. That's probably just failure, but let's check: he's attempting a 15@2 Create Psuedo-Object with a character psi bias of 14@8, so -4 for the skill's bias; the world bias is at least P2@ thanks to Oo-hi's Mental Defense Shield, but could be as high as P15@, so adding the world bias level once gives us a total adjustment of anywhere from -2 to +11. His 1@10 BRA makes that 18 to 31, no teacher, instructor, or example, which only leaves inherent sit-mods. Those sit-mods won't be as low as -18 or as high as +60 (even including the +20 or +30 for time factor), the numbers needed to make 91 a botch or a success, so I needn't worry about it.

Six apparent minutes spent so far.

or are you merely looking for unfamilar substances and examining any such substances that you find?

The above is what I meant although at first I did thought of the tree I saw earlier but I change my mind later because I am unsure that the tree survived the explosion.

You concentrate, but you can't seem to figure out how to transform your inner power into something with material existence. After four apparent minutes, you have nothing to show for your efforts.

I will go through the rift half way then I will face the edge of the rift. This way, half of my spirit is in the other world and I can view both world simultaneously. I will concentrate for 5 apparent minutes then try the skill again.
If I succeed, I will try to move the light ball pass the edge and see if it will be cut in half.

*****

the world bias is at least P2@ thanks to Oo-hi's Mental Defense Shield, but could be as high as P15@

I wonder how it will be calculated if I stand half way through the rift.

a skill learning roll: 91

A near botch indeed.

You regroup and try again once you've positioned yourself between the edges of the portal, centering one edge in your visual field such that one world is on the left and the other is on the right.

Five minutes later you have your breakthrough, and you manage to create your ball of light. It is somewhat dimmer than you had wanted, but otherwise it is exactly as you imagined.

The light ball passes "in" and "out" of the rift easily enough, but when you try to move it through the edge of the portal, it simply stops. Efforts to pass it through the boundry lines of the rift are unsuccessful; you get the impression you would have more success trying to pass it through a brick wall.

_____
You're either in one world or you're in the other. Since the learning roll is a 15, it doesn't matter which.

1@1 Create Light-shedding Force Object P15@2 requires five minutes uninterrupted high concentration; creates a hollow pseudo-object from shaped force which radiates light outward, position manipulable by the skilled user until ignored, continues to exist for a reasonable period thereafter, +13 SM

(Also, while I imagine that your subjective perceptions create the impression that your spirit takes up space, whether or not its position is represented in more than one of the three perceptible spatial dimensions is not yet a settled question in your game. That is, why suppose that your spirit has area or volume - i.e., exists along mutiple points - as would be necessary for your spirit's position to extend into multiple universes?)

I gave thought to the question of how to treat the edges of the portal when it was first created, so no rolls are needed to settle the question of how they interact with the light ball.

Did I examine any peculiar substance before I try to create the light ball?

The light ball passes "in" and "out" of the rift easily enough, but when you try to move it through the edge of the portal, it simply stops.

That actually confirms that my speed is lower than light. I am also surprised at the hardness of the light ball that it does not get cut in half although I try to ram it to the edge at a very high speed (at least at 0.026% speed of light). This raises the question of what would happen if a force greater than the material limit is applied to the edge of the rift. Would the object be split in two or would the rift have some sort of fail-safe mechanism that will absorb the force instead?
That gives me some idea about manipulating the properties of rift.

I will concentrate for four apparent minutes then try to make the rift reverse the space/time around it by making it absorb causality. The first limitation of this skill would be I have to be at the center of the rift at moment of initiating the skill and be one with the rift to avoid the causality of the skill itself be absorbed. This would mean that if the skill works, my spirit will be at the rift position regardless where my body or spirit is previously. The second limitation of the skill is it can only absorb causality up to the moment the rift is first created.
I wonder if the skill is considered as Alter Reality.

*****

You're either in one world or you're in the other.

How do you determine the above? Do you:
1) Roll a dice to determine which world one is currently in?
2) Consider that one is in the previous world until all spirit/body part have gone to the other side?
3) Consider that one is in the next world when any spirit/body part have gone to the other side but will be back to the previous world if all spirit/body part are pull back?
4) Thought of some other way to resolve this problem?

The below calculation could also solve the problem.
The part percentage could be allocated to useful parts that is included in the skill and if any of the useful parts are biased out then the skill would not work.
Average world bias (AWB) = Sum of (Part percentage*World bias/100)
Examples:
1) 50% of P15@ world and 50% of P2@ world:
AWB = (50*15/100) + (50*2/100) = 7.5+1 = 8.5
2) 30% of P15@ world, 30% of P9@ world, 40% of P6@ world:
AWB = (30*15/100) + (30*9/100) + (40*6/100)= 4.5+2.7+2.4 = 9.6

+13 SM

I wonder how you get that value. Does the skill get penalized for something?

That is, why suppose that your spirit has area or volume - i.e., exists along mutiple points - as would be necessary for your spirit's position to extend into multiple universes?

That is an excellent question. I also wonder if Oo-hii sense Morach as one point in space or a being with volume considering that Oo-hii tried to attack Morach. I wonder if Oo-hii would attack a being that only have that much existence. Even a speck of food would be more appetizing to Oo-hii if he view/sense Morach as a one point in space. However, a spirit could exist as one point in space that is wrap by the illusion of one's perception.

I will concentrate for four apparent minutes then try to make the rift reverse the space/time around it by making it absorb causality.

I have no earthly idea what this means. I understand the words "reverse," "space/time," "absorb," and "causality," but when you string them together with other words in this order, I am baffled.

What do you expect to happen if whatever-it-is-you're-trying-to-do succeeds?

Also, I have made a major error. I wrote:

The light ball passes "in" and "out" of the rift easily enough, but when you try to move it through the edge of the portal, it simply stops.

When I wrote that, I ignored the fact that the light ball is a material object, and thus that your efforts to move it, while actually successful, result in no apparent motion. It would move at perhaps one meter per second, which is an apparent rate of about 0.1 mm per minute and a half. Please ignore and forget anything I posted which suggested that the light ball did anything other than shed light and hang apparently motionless in exactly the spot you created it.

Did I examine any peculiar substance before I try to create the light ball?

All substances in the immediate vicinity of the rift are organic (or mixed with organics, in the case of the soil). While nearly every organism nearby is potentially unknown to Earth's scientists (and thus potentially contains novel proteins; does that count?), the most obviously peculiar substance is the photovoltaic-looking bark of the nearest tree, much of which was blasted off in the explosion. The tree's sap glitters, time-frozen as it oozes from the wound to the tree's exterior.

How are you examining the tree bark, and what do you hope to discover or commit to memory?

____

You're either in one world or you're in the other.

How do you determine the above?

I haven't solved this problem yet because it is not yet a problem. When it becomes one, I'll pick a solution.

(That's the answer in my game. If you'd like to discuss the matter in your role as a future referee, you are of course quite welcome to start a thread for that purpose.)

I wonder how you get [+13]. Does the skill get penalized for something?

Yes, I eventually decided to assess -10 for including two effects into one skill (15@1 Create Light and 15@2 Create Shaped Force). I considered simply including the light for free with the restriction that the skill was not capable of creating psuedo-objects which did not shed light. However, when I noticed that the created psuedo-object lasts, at baseline, much longer than most Create Light effects and generally requires less concentration to maintain, I decided that I would rather grant the combined skill the benefit of the better baselines and penalize it with a sit-mod than leave the sit-mod unchanged while restricting it to the duration and concentration baselines of a Create Light.

Most of this sort of thing is left very much to referee's discretion. Your rulings may vary, once you're running games.

That is an excellent question. I also wonder if Oo-hii sense Morach as one point in space or a being with volume considering that Oo-hii tried to attack Morach.

Oo-hii's sixth sense informs him of the locations of nearby *easy-prey* - distance and direction. It provides no information whatever concerning size, shape, volume, or any other characteristic of the creature sensed aside from its location (save that it is capable of being sensed in the first place and thus is *easy-prey*).

The tree's sap glitters, time-frozen as it oozes from the wound to the tree's exterior.
How are you examining the tree bark, and what do you hope to discover or commit to memory?

I examine the tree's sap so that I could detect it with my Detect Materials skill in the future.

Please ignore and forget anything I posted which suggested that the light ball did anything other than shed light and hang apparently motionless in exactly the spot you created it.

Forget about what? (Looks around to remember about the things that have been forgotten.) By the way, that is a good example of space/time reversal which I am the observer/target and you are the person who reverses space/time by absorbing causality. You know that there is something you wanted others to forget but the observer/target would not know about the things that you are talking about.
That confirms that my light ball is actually a material object. It also confirms that I am slower than light because I can see the light from the light ball without moving to it.

What do you expect to happen if whatever-it-is-you're-trying-to-do succeeds?

Space/time would reverse which would make me look like a time traveler that came from the future or something to the observer.

*****

You're either in one world or you're in the other.
If you'd like to discuss the matter in your role as a future referee, you are of course quite welcome to start a thread for that purpose

I think it will have something to do with the nature of portal so probably different portal would have different feature and the solution will depend on them. I will probably add the question to the portal thread I started about a month ago if I have more information about the nature of the portal.

Most of this sort of thing is left very much to referee's discretion. Your rulings may vary, once you're running games.

After reading your ruling a couple of times, I feel that being a good referee is tough job considering there are a lot of factors that have to be considered before making decisions. I wonder if an AI could simulate such referee and how it will interpret the players request. That is also one of the reason that I ask why the referee choose what they choose for future references. By the way, keep up the good work.

distance and direction
any other characteristic of the creature sensed aside from its location

Does it detect the center of the mass or something?
If the prey is big enough, would Oo-hii still sense it as one point in space or multiple points in space when it exceed certain angle or something?

I examine the tree's sap so that I could detect it with my Detect Materials skill in the future.

Noted.

Space/time would reverse which would make me look like a time traveler that came from the future or something to the observer.

Said observer possibly including the you of x-units-of-time ago? That is, do you expect two versions of you to exist (in two different places) at the same time once this skill is successful?

Also, it sounds like you're using the rift as necessary component in the skill and that you are attempting to affect both "sides" of the rift equally. Correct me if these assumptions are wrong.

In the context of Multiverser, I understand time travel. There's a whole appendix devoted to it. If this is a version of time travel, I can handle that. If it's not, we're still miscommunicating.

__

If the prey is big enough, would Oo-hii still sense it as one point in space or multiple points in space when it exceed certain angle or something?

"No." He would sense a distance, and a direction. Neither the distance nor the direction would be so precise as to indicate a single point in space, no matter how big or small the organism happened to be. If you recall, before he attacked you he spent a little time scurrying up and down the tree - triangulating to get a better read on your position.

Noted.

Do I have to add anything to my character sheet as well such as "alien world tree sap" or something?

Said observer possibly including the you of x-units-of-time ago? That is, do you expect two versions of you to exist (in two different places) at the same time once this skill is successful?

The observer does not include Morach's spirit x-units-of-time ago but will include Morach's body because Morach's body is not at the rift location when the skill is initiated. This would mean only one version of Morach will exist in which the spirit form will be at the rift position and the body would be at the location of x-units-of-time ago.

Also, it sounds like you're using the rift as necessary component in the skill and that you are attempting to affect both "sides" of the rift equally. Correct me if these assumptions are wrong.

Yes, that is right.

If this is a version of time travel, I can handle that. If it's not, we're still miscommunicating.

It would probably qualify as a version of time travel. From Morach point of view, the space seems to reverse itself excluding the one that is currently at the rift position at the moment the skill is initiated.

*****

He would sense a distance, and a direction. Neither the distance nor the direction would be so precise as to indicate a single point in space, no matter how big or small the organism happened to be.

Interesting. So the sense would probably have some kind of accuracy range which would probably depend on current situation.

The observer does not include Morach's spirit x-units-of-time ago but will include Morach's body because Morach's body is not at the rift location when the skill is initiated. This would mean only one version of Morach will exist in which the spirit form will be at the rift position and the body would be at the location of x-units-of-time ago.

Huh.

So, suppose x-units-of-time ago Ooh-hii was on his tree, sensing your presence; when you did WIIYD ("whatever-it-is-you're-doing"), you're saying that to Oo-hii, you would appear to have teleported? Your "old" spirit form would vanish, for no apparent reason, and the you-who-used-the-skill would appear inside the rift?

I'm having difficulty understanding why that would happen.

So, suppose x-units-of-time ago Ooh-hii was on his tree, sensing your presence; when you did WIIYD ("whatever-it-is-you're-doing"), you're saying that to Oo-hii, you would appear to have teleported? Your "old" spirit form would vanish, for no apparent reason, and the you-who-used-the-skill would appear inside the rift?

Yes, that would happen. The reason would not be apparent for the observer but would be apparent for Morach. Also Morach is still in hyper-accelerated state which means that he could get back in his previous position if he need to.

I'm having difficulty understanding why that would happen.

That is because the things at the rift position when the skill is initiated will keep their causality but the others causality will be absorbed by the rift. That would mean that Morach's spirit will not be at his previous position but at current position which is the rift. The rift stability will probably collapse if the rift try to absorb causality that caused it which is why the maximum unit that could be absorbed by the rift is only up to when the rift first existed. This would mean that if the skill succeeds, there are probability that the rift destabilizes then closes.